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DNA: humans and chimps

 
black 2017-10-04 10:17:13 

Chimps and humans share a surprising 98% DNA make up.

Now, why do you think that is?

Let's just have a civil debate.

 
Runs 2017-10-04 10:58:49 

In reply to black

Source? Peer reviewed and published in Scientific Journal please tenks wink

 
NineMiles 2017-10-04 11:04:09 

In reply to black

It's just a coincidence....ah think God created the chimps first and then thought to himself he might as well improve the process by adding the additional 2%.

lol razz

 
black 2017-10-04 11:06:04 

In reply to Runs

I didn't think you would question this

 
Chrissy 2017-10-04 11:08:59 

In reply to black

Evolution?

 
Runs 2017-10-04 11:10:32 

In reply to black

Clue - Same DNA structure, give that some thought cool

 
black 2017-10-04 11:11:10 

In reply to NineMiles

It should be the other way around. He fucked up when he created humans (as you stated). lol

 
black 2017-10-04 11:16:26 

In reply to Runs

Clue - Same DNA structure, give that some thought


I didn't say identical but the ancestral link is clear.

 
black 2017-10-04 11:18:22 

In reply to Chrissy

Not so fast!

Let the conversation develop. lol

 
Ninetenjack 2017-10-04 11:43:10 

In reply to black

There is an opinion out there that when beings were fleeing a dying planet and came to earth, they performed genetic engineering on animals and infused themselves into them to create the human being and thereby allowing their species to live on in another form.

 
Runs 2017-10-04 11:45:31 

In reply to Ninetenjack

Can you share that link pardnuh cool

 
Ninetenjack 2017-10-04 11:49:14 

In reply to Runs

Tons of stuff on youtube, I actually saw something on Smithsonian, here is a YT clip.

https://youtu.be/kzRyTNKjfZE

 
bravos 2017-10-04 12:06:45 

In reply to black

That 2% makes all the difference,now imagine us in a similar position but instead we're the chimp.

For all our efforts and advancement we would seem like chimps to them!! smile

 
Runs 2017-10-04 12:09:55 

In reply to Ninetenjack

Smithsonian is more reputable, I would not waste my time looking at YT clips every moron can declare himself an hexpert and upload nonsense. razz

 
NineMiles 2017-10-04 12:34:36 

In reply to Ninetenjack

Are you ToldUso in disguise? lol

 
black 2017-10-04 12:53:39 

In reply to NineMiles

lol lol lol

I think that stuff is total nonsense.

 
nickoutr 2017-10-04 13:09:30 

In reply to black

Chimps and humans share a surprising 98% DNA make up.

I did not come from chimp, monkey or ape ... I was created by our Lord Yahweh Creator of the entire universe ... you can believe in the Piltdown man all you can

 
black 2017-10-04 13:20:43 

In reply to nickoutr

lol lol lol

I know, it's hard to admit.

 
Tryangle 2017-10-04 13:25:46 

Hey the world may be a better place once the events of Planet of the Apes comes to fruition

 
Ninetenjack 2017-10-04 13:35:05 

In reply to black

I think that stuff is total nonsense.


So how do you explain things like these:

https://www.ancient-code.com/meet-nazca-runways-flat-mountaintops-defy-explanation/

Runways and incredible engraved designs that only make sense from above? These exist today in Peru....no one can explain why they are there or the reason they were created and by whom.

 
conman 2017-10-04 14:45:19 

a common ancestor which we both evolved from

evolution

full stop

everything else is uneducated nonsense

 
granite 2017-10-04 14:49:25 

Maybe the Indians(Hindus) know something we don't,don't they believe in a monkey God.

 
Runs 2017-10-04 14:50:19 

Humans did not evolve from chimps, they are distant cousins at best.

Link Text

 
black 2017-10-04 14:56:19 

In reply to Ninetenjack

It's just nature at work, nature has created some pretty amazing sites.

 
black 2017-10-04 15:05:14 

In reply to Runs


Humans did not evolve from chimps, they are distant cousins at best


No one said we evolved from chimps, we share a common ancestry. Meaning, we evolved from the same prehistoric being, chimps went in one direction, humans in another.

 
Runs 2017-10-04 15:24:35 

In reply to black

Saw you read my link razz

 
black 2017-10-04 15:35:31 

In reply to Runs

No, I knew that.

That's why I didn't post a link on my lead post, it's not something I just read.

 
Runs 2017-10-04 15:51:12 

In reply to black

So you basically asked a question in your headline and answered it yourself and took credit? WTF guy lol

 
RemainsUnknown 2017-10-04 15:52:24 

In reply to Runs

So you basically asked a question in your headline and answered it yourself and took credit? WTF guy lol
lol lol lol lol

 
black 2017-10-04 16:09:50 

In reply to Runs

So you basically asked a question in your headline and answered it yourself and took credit? WTF guy


That was not the point of my posts, I was not trying to take credit for anything.

 
Halliwell 2017-10-04 16:24:05 

In reply to black

You share about 40% with a cabbage as well so is that common ancestor but just less?

This is knowing an answer and creating a question retrospectively

Taxonomy was based on phenotype only, then it 'evolved' using internal anatomy, now it further evolves using DNA. What is the definitive criteria for 'relatedness'? In 2017 the guys that classify organisms via genetics will say DNA/RNA. A mosquito isn't related to an elephant just because they both have 2 eyes and one abdomen.

The avian taxonomy tree was massively rearranged due to sequencing in the past 7 years

 
nick2020 2017-10-04 16:27:59 

In reply to Runs

So you basically asked a question in your headline and answered it yourself and took credit? WTF guy


You ever read any of black's threads? lol

And mind you if you disagree with the way you answered this "question" he will tell you you are wrong. I much preferred the black riddler. lol

 
nick2020 2017-10-04 16:29:07 

In reply to Halliwell

You share about 40% with a cabbage as well so is that common ancestor but just less?


Wait what? lol

 
Dan_De_Lyan 2017-10-04 16:33:03 

ah tort we were 97% rib scratcher...now we are 98%?

Are we monkeying up?
big grin

 
black 2017-10-04 16:45:00 

In reply to Runs

I didn't think you would question this


This was my first response to you because I thought you knew this.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 17:56:10 

So does that mean we came from chimps?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 17:56:53 

If so where did the Chimps come from?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 17:58:02 

Are the Chimps DNA also 98% similar in structure to their ...whatever you call what comes before?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 17:59:54 

If the Chimps DNA structure was only 15% similar to humans would the intellectuals have ruled out Evolution then?

 
black 2017-10-04 18:55:14 

In reply to Ayenmol


If the Chimps DNA structure was only 15% similar to humans would the intellectuals have ruled out Evolution then?


You want me to answer an hypothetical question?

What does this do to your creation theory?

 
Emir 2017-10-04 19:34:53 

In reply to Chrissy

Evolution?


Who.. Poster Black? wink

 
black 2017-10-04 19:37:43 

In reply to Emir

Stay off my thread.

 
Emir 2017-10-04 19:43:26 

In reply to black

Okay, I'll send you some bananas smile

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 19:46:14 

In reply to black

Is'nt that what you do in trying to prove this hypothesis?

What difference does it make...you all start with a theory and are trying to prove it by grasping at straws...whatever you find you twist to suit your narrative! Not unlike the very News source you all hate!

There are a million reasons to believe in a designer than to believe Evolution.

What does the fact that whatever came before the Chimp in your imagination does not share 98% of the chimps DNA structure do to your Evolution THEORY?

Dude you are a mental midget grasping at staws to come to a conclusion that you have already reached!

 
black 2017-10-04 20:22:51 

In reply to Ayenmol

Is'nt that what you do in trying to prove this hypothesis


What hypothesis? This is proven science. The science of DNA can tell what country you are from. Have you seen an ancestry commercial lately?

There are a million reasons to believe in a designer than to believe Evolution.


Like what? The Bullshit unproven stuff in the bible?

What does the fact that whatever came before the Chimp in your imagination does not share 98% of the chimps DNA structure do to your Evolution THEORY?


Do you have evidence or you're just making up BS?

What does this do to your bible BS that animals are here for the pleasure of man? Your bible place little importance on animals, yet they are almost genetically identical to humans? What kind of sick joke is your God playing on you?

 
bravos 2017-10-04 20:44:54 

Ayenmol ain fed up get licks in he head? lol poor deluded guy,seems like a good fella doh..

Blessings to you Ayenomal!!

(and none to the non believers)..

 
black 2017-10-04 20:48:56 

In reply to bravos

lol lol lol

 
pelon 2017-10-04 21:01:39 

Ayenmol, preach brother... tell these alternative deviants with their science mumble-jumble to hush. This suggestion we share DNA with primates can't hold a candle to the solid evidence in Genesis. Man came form god taking clay and forming us. He then "breathed air into our nostrils"

Nothing more to investigate. It is in the bible.

Shame on them for contesting the word of your God.

 
bravos 2017-10-04 21:03:31 

In reply to pelon

Oh god oh,you go kill meh!!!!!!! lol lol lol lol

 
black 2017-10-04 21:20:11 

In reply to pelon


Dude, Yuh kill meh!!! lol lol lol

 
bravos 2017-10-04 22:05:04 

In reply to black

You dead too!! Time for a mass resurrection!!

Or is this where we go to heaven?

Ayenomal we need yuh bredda!! sad

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 22:20:54 

Why is if thsst you all scan all these evolution sites waiting for morsels of info? Then as soon as you all see even a scrap you run here and post?

Why? Like a child who loves a comic series and waits as the creators develop his character.

Are you all so unsure of your conviction that you need constant validation?

Or is it just ghat evolution is your God and you must worship at it's temple of "discovery" then indoctrinate the unbelievers?

Strange. I learn new spiritual enlightenment almost daily, yet I do not run out here seeking validation for everyg new development in spiritual understanding.

What are you all searching for on these sites?

 
bravos 2017-10-04 22:29:11 

In reply to Ayenmol

Nothing but lies,you know not the creator anymore than Black,Pelon,Lucifer or myself.

Either your'e a liar or very delusional,the choice is yours,either way you can be cured,thanks to trial and error painstaking science. Your quick fix is just that,a quick selfish fix.

Why does god love you and none of the millions of children killed every year? How obnoxious and entitled of you.

 
bravos 2017-10-04 22:36:07 

In reply to Ayenmol

Strange. I learn new spiritual enlightenment almost daily, yet I do not run out here seeking validation for everyg new development in spiritual understanding.


Spirits cannot cure polio or chicken pox,too much ghost talk,time to touch the ground of reality.

Your 'spirituality' is simply personal education and realization,it isn't limited to superstition,you have absolutely nothing on anyone else here,we all have personal revelations,clear your eyes of the simmi dimmi and only then you would be one with yourself.

 
pelon 2017-10-04 22:36:56 

In reply to Ayenmol

Like a child who loves a comic series and waits as the creators develop his character.

hammer them Ayenmol... hammer them

Did you read these comics: King James Version - that run was excellent. I totally got into the part where Moses took out his epic staff and parted the dead sea....

Or the time a seven headed serpent appeared and was cast into the abyss(Revelation 20:1-3)

Those where some bad ass comics.

Do you attended comic-con?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 22:43:16 

In reply to bravos

,you have absolutely nothing on anyone else here


There lies the root cause for the vitriol and obsession.

I have a relationship with the true God. Am sure of it!
I issue no apologies for it! Too bad you do not wish to humble yourself otherwise you could too!

I never seen a man claim enlightenment so filled with vitriol for the beliefs of others.

Go see one ah dem science folk I think there is a field of study that can help yoh deal with this pent up hate!

 
bravos 2017-10-04 22:51:26 

In reply to Ayenmol

You insane bro,but in a nice harmless way,mildly annoying but that's ok

I hope the church don't fall on you ok..

Good luck with your conflicts in your selfish quest for eternal self preservation.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-04 22:56:31 

In reply to bravos

Man stop allowing fear to run your life! Stop allowing your uncertainty and lack of trust in evolution to cause you to lash out at those who believe in the Bible as misdirection for your insecurities!

That goes for the other posters and the new recruit too!

Keep on keeping on. I have no doubt of where I stand!

 
bravos 2017-10-04 23:10:48 

In reply to Ayenmol

Man stop allowing fear to run your life! Stop allowing your uncertainty and lack of trust in evolution to cause you to lash out at those who believe in the Bible as misdirection for your insecurities!


I stopped living a life of fear the day I turned my back on your jealous conflicted god of genocide.


Keep on keeping on. I have no doubt of where I stand!


Neither do

1.6 Billion Muslims.

I.2 Billion Hindus.

1 Billion Buddhist.

Therefore you're an atheist to all those other beliefs,you just have to go one more and you good.

When your god starts to talk back to you get back to me,in the meantime you just wishing upon a star,a man made one at that.

You come from a school of thought that castigated your mother for her menstrual cycle,the idiots didn't know that was necessary simple biology,a school of thought that said the earth was flat and the sky an ornamental glass dome with the sun setting in a marsh

In no uncertain terms I resent the credulity of anyone with the slightest of intelligence accepting that and worshiping that.

You like the Chimp,you missing a few %,just a few...but you can be healed..

 
black 2017-10-04 23:25:43 

In reply to bravos

Damn Bravos, do kill him with logic. lol

 
bravos 2017-10-05 00:05:17 

In reply to black

The problem for him is it's much easier to deliver logic than fairy tales.

He has no real platform,just a misguided springboard ..

 
bravos 2017-10-05 00:07:40 

In reply to black

Nuh even a blasted springboard,a squeaky springy board.. smile

 
bravos 2017-10-05 00:10:23 

In reply to black

er ee er ee er uh..

But he need not worry, it's replaceable!!

 
Norm 2017-10-05 00:12:43 

Hahaha! Ayenmol on a roll. Got black's cabal on the run!

BTW, black probably has closer to 100% chimp DNA than most folks here, judging from the way he handles his posts.

Of course, he and his cabal will assert they are right (about what, Heaven only knows), high five each other, throw a few nasty cuss at something religious, and declare themselves "winners" of their self-proclaimed anti-God crusade.

Look, the pro-God crusade is far bigger than all you, and frankly, all you have nothing in the way of big ammo. All you only have nasty mouth!

Ayenmol is right to declare that you guys forever need validation. Add "reassurance" to that too!

Luckily, the actions of some of you tell a different story from your words. So, all's good in the end. All you are just good brethren exercising your God given right to cuss God!

 
Norm 2017-10-05 02:48:34 

In reply to bravos

Neither do: 1.6 Billion Muslims, 1.2 Billion Hindus, 1 Billion Buddhists.

Therefore you're an atheist to all those other beliefs.

Darn, Bravos. You're making some sense here, bro. This is one of my arguments against any specific religion as well. They undermine themselves by excluding other believers.

Allow me to add some history, if you may.

Out of Hinduism came Buddhism, because Gautama could not accept justification of the caste system and injustice on the basis re-incarnation dictated by karma. He, in turn, posited that re-incarnation was the path to nirvana - not to a higher caste or a "better" human life.

Buddhism quickly spread to the East (of India) and was brought to the west by the Huns and Mongols, before the latter adopted Islam. Many Buddhist religious practices were adopted by the early Christian church (both Catholic and Orthodox). These included the use of the rosary (prayer beads), the chalice, the priest's ceremonial garb, etc.

Out of early Christianity came Islam, as the church split over the doctrine of the Trinity that was adopted by Christian church, at the behest of Roman emperor Constantine. He allowed both Christianity and Roman "pagan" beliefs to exist side by side in the Roman Empire, enjoying equal official status.

The Trinity doctrine elevated Jesus from prophet to "God" status - a view which was obviously not shared by a major part of the church back then. After the split over the Trinity, the Christian church continued to split into many pieces over all sorts of issues, such as the Holy Communion (bread and wine being truly converted into the body and blood of Jesus) and everything else - much of which you guys raise here - but in a disorganised manner.

Of course, all the other religions have split up among themselves too, with everyone having no problem slaughtering those of their own religion, to further their materialist objectives.

So, all these religions have actually influenced each other substantially, in beliefs or practices. Their departures from each other provide much food for thought, and are a goldmine of ideas for anyone interested in a critical analysis of religions.

Even the Bible itself provides serious internal criticism, with Jesus being extraordinary in his criticism of Judaism, both old and contemporary, relative to his time.

The source of the best criticism of religion is the religious scriptures themselves. No discussion of substance on religion could occur without a good working knowledge of religious scriptures of any religion, or the history of religion. The same could be said of a technical discussion, based on science.

 
Norm 2017-10-05 03:04:39 

In reply to black

Chimps and humans share a surprising 98% DNA make up.

Sure. Chimps are considered the closest living relatives of humans, but other mammals share a very high percentage of DNA with humans too. Even plants have a great deal of the same DNA as humans.

As usual, your topic is superficially pointless, but everyone knows you are essentially seeking validation (per Ayenmol) for your anti-God crusade. You are just too weak to be up front about it.

Logically, evolution and creation are not mutually exclusive - despite religious or "scientific" dogma. Nothing excludes evolution being a tool of deliberate creation by intelligent beings - just like scientific procedure is tool for inventors.

The vast gap in intellect between man and all other animals, including chimps, actually raises a question about evolution. Why isn't there a proportional variation in the intellectual capacity of man and beast, based on the amount of common DNA?

Put that in your pipe and smoke it. I am sure Ayenmol would love to see your take on that!

 
DukeStreet 2017-10-05 03:45:14 

In reply to bravos
As much as I think about this whole evolution thingy, I am more in the camp of what Ninetenjack subscribes to. There is a whole lot of strangeness of who we are, what we are doing here and why we are sooo different from any other species on "our" planet.

If we are to just step outside of our religious/spiritual beliefs, just for one moment, and think outside of the box, ask yourself why are we so different from anything else on the planet. And hard as it is to do, try not to tie religion into that answer.

cool

 
black 2017-10-05 08:17:37 

In reply to Norm and Ayenmol

If Jesus was God, why didn't he let his followers know, the earth was round?

Why didn't they have a basic concept of other planets without the solar system?

Why didn't he let them know, the earth was not 6 thousand years old? Instead, he left them open to making excuses about, one biblical year being more than a calendar year.

How long is a biblical year?

Why did he leave them open to be embarrassed by the scientific community, by exposing their ignorance and gross lack of knowledge?

And, how could they prove that Jesus was God, when his followers didn't have basic knowledge of his universe?

Wouldn't that knowledge, factor in making the determination if he is indeed, God?

 
conman 2017-10-05 08:46:21 

In reply to Norm

Logically, evolution and creation are not mutually exclusive


except there is not a lick of evidence to suggest creation happened

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 09:14:40 

In reply to conman

Lol! I tell you. What evidence do you need? You want a label on everything that says manufactured by the Creator in Eden?

Tell me what evidence of Creation need appear?

 
black 2017-10-05 09:18:22 

In reply to Norm

Logically, evolution and creation are not mutually exclusive - despite religious or "scientific" dogma. Nothing excludes evolution being a tool of deliberate creation by intelligent beings - just like scientific procedure is tool for inventors.


Nonsense. Most biblical scholars and the religious community want evolution excluded from teaching in schools and other institutions. How come they don't see it that way?

The vast gap in intellect between man and all other animals, including chimps, actually raises a question about evolution. Why isn't there a proportional variation in the intellectual capacity of man and beast, based on the amount of common DNA?


Do you think humans were this intelligent, thousands of years ago? Your bible is proof of evolving intelligence or lack of, and that was not that long ago.

 
conman 2017-10-05 09:23:48 

In reply to Ayenmol

any

 
Runs 2017-10-05 09:26:34 

In reply to DukeStreet

Nice, I want hear more discussion on such but d man post some fly by night YouTube crap. Let's bring in Neil DeGrasse into the discussion. wink

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 09:29:29 

In reply to black

You are just like Trump, you simply come up with ludicrous arguments based on limited understanding of what you are trying to argue and in your mind it makes sense. Your knowledge of the Bible is so sparse it is laughable. I do not even bother to answer your questions on the Bible, they are so convoluted and uninformed.
It's like someone asking, why can't we put gas in a diesel, it burns cleaner? And...they both come from fossil fuel!

You are trying to make the Bible suit your ignorant view of life and what is important in life than understand the Bible role in teaching you about the subject. It's the foreword in the manual of futility.

 
conman 2017-10-05 09:31:46 

In reply to DukeStreet

If we are to just step outside of our religious/spiritual beliefs, just for one moment, and think outside of the box, ask yourself why are we so different from anything else on the planet. And hard as it is to do, try not to tie religion into that answer.


what do you mean by different?
all creatures are different

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 09:38:27 

In reply to conman

Whenever you come in contact with something new do you ever think, jee i wonder how this evolved.

Or do yoh instead wonder who designed, created, thought of it?

Can you show me the evidence ovv things in the process of evolution?

Since we are evolving, why is it that a healthy parent gives birth to a sick child?

Why are there still as many simple organisms now as ever? Or do you have evidence that shows otherwise.
Where is this gene that some organisms posses that allows them to "evolve" while others of their species do not.

If it is survival of the fittest, why are the chimps stronger than the "evolved"?

 
black 2017-10-05 09:40:02 

In reply to Ayenmol

Apparently, you don't have much knowledge of the bible either. Here we are, thousands of years later and this stuff is still laughable.

The people that wrote the bible, did you a disservice by having you try to explain a bunch of convoluted nonsense.

 
conman 2017-10-05 09:40:41 

In reply to Ayenmol

lets not move the goal post

is there any reason i should believe that creation happened?

is there any evidence that it happened?

 
conman 2017-10-05 09:44:04 

In reply to Ayenmol

Since we are evolving, why is it that a healthy parent gives birth to a sick child?


defects in genes, or my presumption, im not an expert in the subject

now, why would god make a sick child?

 
black 2017-10-05 09:48:58 

In reply to Ayenmol

Can you show me the evidence ovv things in the process of evolution?


Lots of evidence, visit the Galapagos Island.

 
black 2017-10-05 09:51:19 

In reply to Ayenmol


Since we are evolving, why is it that a healthy parent gives birth to a sick child?


Stupid question. Many factors can cause a baby to be unhealthy.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 09:51:56 

In reply to black

1 Cor 2: 11 For who among men knows the things of a man except the man’s spirit within him? So, too, no one has come to know the things of God except the spirit of God. 12 Now we received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit that is from God, so that we might know the things that have been kindly given us by God. 13 These things we also speak, not with words taught by human wisdom, but with those taught by the spirit, as we explain* spiritual matters with spiritual words. 14 But a physical man does not accept* the things of the spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot get to know them, because they are examined spiritually. 15 However, the spiritual man examines all things, but he himself is not examined by any man. 16 For “who has come to know the mind of Jehovah,* so that he may instruct him?” But we do have the mind of Christ. ^ 1 Cor. 2: 6 Or “this age.” See Glossary. ^ 1 Cor. 2: 8 Or “this age.” See Glossary. ^ 1 Cor. 2: 8 Or “executed on the stake.” ^ 1 Cor. 2: 13 Or “combine.” ^ 1 Cor. 2: 14 Or “receive.” ^ 1 Cor. 2: 16 See App. A 5.


Why are you so quick to question my knowledge of the Bible? Why don't you speak for yourself?

I choose not to engage you because it is a waste of time. You hate the Bible and those who choose to believe it! Evolution is simply your avenue to detract from those who use the argument that those who believe nothing fall for everything.
That is why you keep scouring evolution sites for every bit of new info to use...because you yourself are not convinced and keep searching for new info to quench your discontent.

Funny how you all love calling Christianity and the Bible as a White man's tool of control but you gulp down evolution which was relatively recently started by White men!

 
bravos 2017-10-05 09:53:44 

In reply to conman

now, why would god make a sick child?


Yep!!

 
pelon 2017-10-05 09:56:43 

In reply to conman

well done!

is there any reason i should believe that creation happened? is there any evidence that it happened?
The bible serves as documented evidence, with a clear, simple presentation of how the "heaven and earth" was created (Genesis 1:1-31).

Whether we accept that account as valid or not is subject to debate, but that does serve as creationist evidence.

is there any reason i should believe that creation happened?

Absolutely YES! They are many reasons for YOU and/or anyone to believe the account in Genesis.
The contention only enters when you EXCLUDE any other evidence for consideration. THAT is the problem, religion has made it a "sin" to question that which was written. (and have used tools like fear and threats and intimidation) to ensure that for generations to come - THAT account is what many will believe.

In summary: The account in Genesis is an early attempt, and for many the ONLY and FINAL account of how the Universe came into existence. While we can snicker and bicker about it, we must respect that most people will never be able to break the thinking that was programmed into them from birth: "The word of God is Final"

 
black 2017-10-05 09:58:13 

In reply to Ayenmol

Why are you so quick to question my knowledge of the Bible? Why don't you speak for yourself?


Because it is not proven, it's a bunch of nonsensical hearsay.

Funny how you all love calling Christianity and the Bible as a White man's tool of control but you gulp down evolution which was relatively recently started by White men!


Science is evolving and getting better, you cannot say the same for the bible. It's the same bullshit from thousands of years ago.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 09:58:39 

In reply to black

Many factors can cause a baby to be unhealthy.


But we're evolving...and we are on the top of the evolutionary chain...so why can't this imaginary gene evolve to eradicate whatever other gene it has control over to quit allowing us to grow old get sick and die? Aren't those issues enemy number one for all living things?

I mean, we got rid of crawling, breathing water, tails, scales, wings, beaks, ability to regenerate body parts, eggs, Muscles, speed but not enemy number 1, DEATH!

I mean there are trees that live hundreds of years, so that gene exist, then why did the evolution gene not identify this as building block numero uno?

 
conman 2017-10-05 10:06:19 

In reply to pelon

In summary: The account in Genesis is an early attempt, and for many the ONLY and FINAL account of how the Universe came into existence. While we can snicker and bicker about it, we must respect that most people will never be able to break the thinking that was programmed into them from birth: "The word of God is Final"


human minds change right throughout history, especially when we cant justify the reason. We must call out and debate ridiculous beliefs or we hamper progress. I mean most if not all christians are christian-ish, they have no cares to really follow the bible in its entirety. And as time when on they followed less and less of it. They eat shrimp, they mix fabrics, they dont stone women or children and they dont own slaves (the bible does support slavery). So its fair to think that in time most of the works will just be ignored.

 
bravos 2017-10-05 10:14:44 

In reply to Ayenmol

But we're evolving...and we are on the top of the evolutionary chain...


lol!! really!! Joke of the day and a clear example of obnoxious man..let your god strike earth hard and see if humans are the highest evolved...

Or did you mean among humanoids?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 10:15:41 

In reply to conman

I mean most if not all christians are christian-ish, they have no cares to really follow the bible in its entirety.


Yeah those are called imitation Christians. You know, those who associate themselves with an identity because it is the popular/expedient thing to do. Not unlike many who claim to believe evolution but can barely State what it means.

But I find interesting how you speak of Christianity like it is something that a certain segment of people are just born with.

 
bravos 2017-10-05 10:16:53 

In reply to DukeStreet

Good stuff... cool cool

Buh dey does get me vex...lol..

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 10:18:24 

In reply to bravos

of obnoxious man..

Or did you mean among humanoids?


Yeah, I thought you would ignore the elephant in the room while trying to show your knowledge...i could have told you this would be your response...please tell of the non humanoids that live on endlessly!

 
conman 2017-10-05 10:20:31 

In reply to Ayenmol

do you follow/support everything the bible commands?

 
bravos 2017-10-05 10:20:59 

In reply to Ayenmol

Bro I take no pleasure in constantly battering you but you give no other choice ok..

In the future keep your improbable beliefs to yourself..

Any man come telling me bout god and how he better than me with his eye on my 10%, wifey and my pretty sons is loud cuss dis rounds..

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 10:31:50 

In reply to bravos

You can piece together from bits and pieces of your arguments exactly what eats at you all.

From bravo showing how much he feels left out by Christian beliefs that only they have God's approval. To the new comer talking about the one account of Genesis, and on and on. Stinks of jealousy and envy! That's it!

You all do not want to humble yourselves before God! But how dare others believe that there is a God who likes them more than you!?

End of story. Kick rocks!

 
bravos 2017-10-05 10:36:23 

In reply to Ayenmol

Bro bro bro you doing it again.

And even if there was a heaven as described by your religion who in their right mind want to be part of a celestial dictatorship sitting on some man lap praising the dear leader for eternity and smiling down..wtf who really wants that ?

At least you can die and escape North Korea.


Doesn't your god have the slightest respect or consideration for the complicated creatures he created in his likeness?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 10:38:41 

In reply to bravos

Is that why the evolution gene keeps fixing everything but that which affects us all? Kim Jong Un?

 
bravos 2017-10-05 10:41:59 

In reply to Ayenmol

Bro your beliefs and science don't mix,please stop it..

You reminding me of the Noah's ark 'creation museum' with dinosaurs now..You guys are the best at conveniently shifting the goal posts..keep shifting,very soon there would be no margin to allow for shift.

What next Mary had a little lamb and not an immaculate conception?

Keep evolution out of your convos for now,you sounding very daft ok..

 
bravos 2017-10-05 10:45:46 

God is blessing Ayenmol..

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 10:50:22 

In reply to bravos

Am moving the goal post? Like how evolutionist started with survival of the fittest but still all are dying?

You still are yet to explain to me why we lost all that we lost to become "humanoids" yet the same thing that has plagued us from the Big bang till now continues to plague us?

I guess you still going with Kim Jong Un derstanding!

At least Black know when to leave when he have nothing to say...YOU just keep tangling yourself in foolishness!

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 11:03:24 

Am still waiting fof the Scientist here to explain to me... isn't Science supposed to be the bastion of logical reason?...why evolution kept changing so many things to the point of where we are today...although there are still animals existing all around us with the very same qualities that "we" just could not live with...but it has ignored the few things that threaten us all?

Why are we getting "better" in every way but the way every human would give all they have to find?

In fact evolution is yet to cure a single ail of living things. There are more things that kill us now than ever! In fact the next time a Scientist finds a cure to a disease, why don't they attribute it to evolution rather than place their name on it as the Creator/ designer who through hard work brought it to life!

The next time you all decide to start an Evolution thread, let's start with the Scientific reason for that!

 
black 2017-10-05 11:08:57 

In reply to Ayenmol

At least Black know when to leave when he have nothing to say...YOU just keep tangling yourself in foolishness!


At work bro, no time for in depth conversations.

Bravo's is doing a good job though.

 
Larr Pullo 2017-10-05 11:12:44 

In reply to Chrissy

Evolution?


How come Chimps aren't still evolving into Human beings? Apart from Khaga name one chimp that turned into a human?

 
conman 2017-10-05 11:12:59 

In reply to Ayenmol


Why are we getting "better" in every way but the way every human would give all they have to find?


wut?

 
conman 2017-10-05 11:13:20 

In reply to Larr Pullo

common ancestor

 
black 2017-10-05 11:18:03 

In reply to conman

wut?
lol

Try to unscramble that. lol

 
black 2017-10-05 11:21:15 

They cannot evolve into humans because they already evolved into something else.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 11:22:09 

In reply to conman

wut?


Really? Why don't ask yourself that question? Aren't you human, or chimp.

Why do black folks bother get upset when they are identified with monkeys?

According to you all it's the truth... but no one protest those more than the author of this thread.

So Political association of Blacks to monkeys ...BAD!

Scientific association, Great!

 
Runs 2017-10-05 11:23:40 

Why is an extra terrestrial being leaving us here so far fetched? It would explain angels, lord of the world's etc razz
If they are in existence, they may be able to monitor things on earth and can fulfill biblical prophesies etc.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 11:25:21 

Some people just have a Chimp on their shouldrr.

 
conman 2017-10-05 11:26:42 

In reply to Ayenmol

common ancestor

is that so hard to understand?

 
bravos 2017-10-05 11:35:04 

In reply to conman

Science isn't his strong suit,its a mystery to him.

Try discussing topics on 'The Unknown'.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 11:39:50 

Still waiting for an answer....or someone to refute my reasoning!

Come on you dancing chimps!

 
conman 2017-10-05 11:42:28 

In reply to Ayenmol

if lost your question is the rabble

what is it?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 11:45:01 

In reply to bravos

Science isn't his strong suit,its a mystery to him.


Every comment you make identifies you as insecure!

Your obsession with perception and thought is almost sad.

It is all a matter of prestige to you. That is all your mind meanders to. Social insecurities!

Newton was a great Scientific mind. He rejected Evolution!

You must be smarter than him. Or have we evolved so much since then?

 
pelon 2017-10-05 11:52:34 

In reply to Ayenmol

Why are we getting "better" in every way but the way every human would give all they have to find?

Can you please decode that?

Evolution is not "getting better". That is the first error in your understanding. Evolution is more about adaptation for survival, over great spans of time of living organisms to cope with their environment. Has nothing to do with "getting better" as you define.

Evolution is a selection by some kind of environmental selection that causes one trait to be preferred over another. Evolution takes place over time. Think survival of the fittest - in slow motion.

Another concept with evolution but separate is Random mutation.... this is very important, however these are complex scientific details, not something you can convince YOU of in a web forum.

 
bravos 2017-10-05 11:58:42 

In reply to Ayenmol

Every comment you make identifies you as insecure!


Sorry but that would be you..

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 12:01:16 

In reply to pelon

Evolution is more about adaptation for survival, over great spans of time of living organisms to cope with their environment.


That what the word has "evolved" to in order to mask the myriad holes in your argument.

Evolution teaches that man came from fish! What environmental selection that caused a fish to decide it is better to go live on land?

I guess the next evolution will be that man abandons his physical body to become a spirit and dwell with the wind?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 12:14:30 

In reply to bravos

Sorry but hat would be you..


Na. Just you. I have never used emotional words to describe your effect on me. I just say you wrong! You are the one trying to paint yourself as more educated, and those who believe different as being ignorant of Science. There are myriads of scientist who reject evolution!

You want to label all who believe in Creation as old fashioned and evolutionist as enlightened.

I just tell you you are wrong.

You all keep seeking validation...case in point that person you know nothing about that you choose to use his thoughts against Religion as your own while claiming Christians have not thought intelligently about their choice to worship a creator!

Your constantly berating those who choose to think differently than you is right in line with the vitriol used by all those who hold themselves above others in this World! Racist, Nationalist, etc.

Anyhoo....am yet to hear any response to why as the former poster noted adaptation for survival has done away with traits that many animals still possess and are thriving, but not sickness and death that plagues all living organisms...that evolution gene must not be bright at all!

Seems like we are surviving despite it's inability to pinpoint the really important issues that we face!

 
pelon 2017-10-05 12:17:19 

In reply to Ayenmol

Evolution teaches that man came from fish!

No sir. It does not.

Evolution is not a statement, it is a process that facilitates observation, that which is documented in fossils and other means, for scientific evaluation.

We interpret the data and make informed conclusions. These conclusions are NOT WRITTEN in stone, and as investigative science evaluates the evidence, findings and conclusions are published.

This my dear sir is a robust process that does not assert itself as FACT until after the rigors of the Scientific Method have been applied.

 
Runs 2017-10-05 12:17:22 

Science n Facts in alyuh skurs

From American Journal of Human Genetics

The October issue is online! Find out more about Neandertal alleles that influence modern phenotypic variation, mutations that lead to female infertility, a method to identify genes harboring dominant mutations AND MORE!!

Homo Sapiens and Neanderthals mated and we got their diseases. cool


Uncovering Neanderthal Haplotypes in Light-Associated Traits
Dannemann and Kelso, p. 578
Recent studies have demonstrated that introgression of Neanderthal DNA at certain loci has influenced a variety of traits in modern humans. Many of these studies have specifically examined Neanderthal alleles that might contribute to human disease. With the advent of very large, well-phenotyped cohorts that include healthy individuals, additional questions related to the Neanderthal contribution to common traits can be better addressed. In this issue, Dannemann and Kelso use genotype data from more than 150,000 participants in the UK BioBank to identify likely archaic haplotypes and associations between these haplotypes and 136 non-disease-related phenotypes in modern humans. They found a significant contribution of Neanderthal alleles to pigmentation traits, including skin and hair color, height, sleep patterns, mood phenotypes, and smoking status. In contrast to some previous studies, this work suggests that Neanderthal alleles contribute to a wide range of skin and hair colors. Notably, several of these traits are influenced by sun exposure, suggesting that these results might represent the selection and introgression of traits that were advantageous to Neanderthals who inhabited lower-light latitudes before modern humans.
lol

 
bravos 2017-10-05 12:30:01 

In reply to Runs

Homo Sapiens and Neanderthals mated and we got their diseases. cool


that must've bin some nasty sex...Would definitely pay to see that flick...lol smile

Oh no we can't talk about sex!

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 12:43:23 

In reply to Runs

Homo Sapiens and Neanderthals mated and we got their diseases.


So these beings did not evolve for millions of years before mating?

 
Runs 2017-10-05 12:50:48 

In reply to Ayenmol

Where I am confused is by Adam and Eve, how long ago were they in existence?

 
Runs 2017-10-05 13:16:26 

In reply to Ayenmol

Kelso notes that the traits influenced by Neandertal DNA, including skin and hair pigmentation, mood, and sleeping patterns are all linked to sunlight exposure. When modern humans arrived in Eurasia about 100,000 years ago, Neandertals had already lived there for thousands of years. They were likely well adapted to lower and more variable levels of ultraviolet radiation from the sun than the new human arrivals from Africa were accustomed to. cool

 
black 2017-10-05 15:58:24 

In reply to Ayenmol

Why do black folks bother get upset when they are identified with monkeys?

According to you all it's the truth... but no one protest those more than the author of this thread.

So Political association of Blacks to monkeys ...BAD!


It's not about monkeys, it's about racism.

 
gvenkat 2017-10-05 16:37:03 

In reply to Larr Pullo

Apart from Khaga name one chimp that turned into a human?


yo yo.. WTF? lol

 
DukeStreet 2017-10-05 18:02:25 

In reply to conman

what do you mean by different?
all creatures are different

Most, if not all, earth creatures are limited in what they can do.

We seem to have an infinite level of things we can do and create at any given time. Name any other known earth-bound creature that has the ability to do this.

lol

 
DukeStreet 2017-10-05 18:04:54 

In reply to Runs

Why is an extra terrestrial being leaving us here so far fetched? It would explain angels, lord of the world's etc razz
If they are in existence, they may be able to monitor things on earth and can fulfill biblical prophesies etc.

You are getting closer to the real questions, sir.
lol

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-05 18:08:33 

In reply to DukeStreet

They want others to explain themselves while claiming they got it all figured out, but they cannot answer the simplest questions.

Doh bother with them is bad mind they bad mind!

 
Runs 2017-10-05 18:16:52 

In reply to DukeStreet

For all you know we may have been convicts who they decided to banish to earth like the Brits did and send to Oz razz
If proven then this will so easily explain the pyramids etc as they are a way more advanced civilization.

 
NineMiles 2017-10-05 18:29:10 

In reply to Runs

For all you know we may have been convicts who they decided to banish to earth like the Brits did and send to Oz razz
If proven then this will so easily explain the pyramids etc as they are a way more advanced civilization.


You've been watching a re-run of Stargate I see! lol

 
Runs 2017-10-05 18:33:55 

In reply to NineMiles

lol could be staring at us right in the face all these centuries

 
granite 2017-10-05 19:43:53 

In reply to bravos
He goin kill me to bravs.

lol lol lol

 
bravos 2017-10-05 20:20:41 

In reply to granite

Doh study he,he calling me insecure but he's the one with all the imaginary friends including fathers,sons,concubines and angels !!

ROTFLMAO!! lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol

 
Norm 2017-10-06 00:22:42 

In reply to black

If Jesus was God, why didn't he let his followers know, the earth was round?

It was already known at that time that the Earth was round, with a circumference of about 40,000 km - because (Greek) Erastothenes had proven that about 500 years before. In any case, Jesus was more interested in how men behaved toward each other ("Love thy neighbor") than in their ability to exploit the Earth and each other.

Why didn't they have a basic concept of other planets without the solar system?

The concept of the "heavens" certainly existed at that time, along with the notion that the heavens were vast enough to contain other habitable "worlds".

How long is a biblical year?

Biblical year? You made that up, didn't you?
The annual cycle of the seasons, and its length, were known. Different calendars were in use at the time - Roman, Jewish, etc. These were organised differently, with the Roman calendar being somewhat similar to today's western calendar.

Why did he leave them open to be embarrassed by the scientific community, by exposing their ignorance and gross lack of knowledge?

Man, sometimes your own "ignorance" could be embarrassing. The "scientific community" in the time (and place) of Jesus consisted mostly of Persians (from whom came "the Three Wise Men") and Romans using Greek knowledge.
If you were referring to today's scientific community, then I would have to remind you that today's geniuses will also appear to be "exposing their ignorance and gross lack of knowledge" to generations 2000 years into the future.

And, how could they prove that Jesus was God, when his followers didn't have basic knowledge of his universe?
Wouldn't that knowledge, factor in making the determination if he is indeed, God?

So, proof is contingent upon knowledge and understanding, in your opinion. Thus, magnetism cannot be proven, according to such reasoning. You would probably also have magnetism rejected!

Furthermore, in your view "God" could only be "God" if men so determined! Nice! Man, armed with his science, now runs the universe!

 
Norm 2017-10-06 00:39:44 

In reply to black

Most biblical scholars and the religious community want evolution excluded from teaching in schools and other institutions.

The fact is that "creation" and "religion" are excluded from US public schools.
Do you think humans were this intelligent, thousands of years ago?

Naw! Men brought fire, weapons, the wheel, agriculture, cooking, etc, with them from chimpkind to mankind as they evolved. They built the pyramids, invented writing and math, made paper and gunpowder, etc, entirely by fluke.

Those stupid bastards of thousands of years ago could not possibly be intelligent - unless modern man determines this to be so! At least the poor things have something in common with "God".

Still, at the end of the day, this persistent inquiry into this subject is commendable, regardless of the spin placed on the subject.

 
Norm 2017-10-06 00:52:29 

In reply to pelon

that does serve as creationist evidence.

Have you ever looked at "creationist evidence"? Or, does uninformed cynicism pass for unbiased scientific methodology here?

 
pelon 2017-10-06 07:54:17 

In reply to Norm

In great detail and over many years. You may even remember, at this is one example, my detail analysis of the timelines of creation, as per Genesis.

The foolish assumptions made is that if you don't believe, you must not of investigated, or read or spent half your life in church.

Part of a systematic evidence based assessment is to look at all evidence, not one side.

You sir, may be underestimating my appreciation of the Bible as an important document. The difference only in literal interpretation blanketly

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 08:00:25 

In reply to Norm

Nice attempt at reason. Pretty sure that went right over their heads because they are not interested in reason, just obnoxious ridicule of the beliefs of others.

Watch how not one of them will touch a single point you have eloquently made, they let it sit there, then come with a different line of attack without addressing a single point you addressed then eventually they come back to the same argument you just refuted without acknowledging your explanation of these points.

I have posted numerous times how in the days of Job, who lived even before Moses time, he described the Earth as suspended on nothing.
In questioning Job when job thought that Jehovah was responsible for his suffering (imagine that you still have people today who blame God for their suffering, like hurricanes, when the entire book of Job is a lesson that God is not the source of suffering.) Jehovah himself questios Job. Many of his questions to Job are based on Nature!

Read the book of Job! Those of you who seek understanding of why man suffers. Why we cannot question our Creator. He addresses horses, that is my favorite. He ask job why, why do horses run into battle unafraid? What other animal does that?

He talks about the wisdom given to certain animals, and not others. He singles out the Eagle as having the keener eyesight! Did discovery channel teach Job that? If it were simple Job making the argument? Has Science proven that wrong?
He questions Job on the laws governing the Earth and Heavens...How did Job know that the laws governing the Heavens are different from Earth's?

There are other books that tackle these subjects that are laughed at today. But the few times the Bible does, it is spot on!

Isaiah 40 speaks of the Circle of the Earth, in fact the Hebrew word he uses is more descriptive of a sphere! He speaks of the Heavens as a gauze!

There are no mention of Aliens in the Bible. No wild swings of imagination that have been disputed! Imagine that...66 books, 40 writers from all walks of life spanning 1600 years! Yet not once while talking about the Earth or Heaven did they mention anything that can be proven wrong!

All the laws given to the Israelites can be explained as having benefits! Laws on hygiene stand the test of time! Laws on animals they could eat and those they were to avoid can be scientifically explained today!

Governments today's law covers hundreds of pages and needs and need a lawyer to decipher! All of them were covered in just 10 commandments! Even to this day people can identify with every single one of those laws!

Jesus! Jesus used the water when talking to crowds! It is well known today how good a conductor of sound water is! He never said he used the boat because of that, but he did and it makes sense that he did! The most practical way he could have perched himself so that all could hear using the natural scientific auditorium like laws of nature is exactly what he did on occasion. Why?

There are so many reasons to believe the Bible!

Another reason the Bible triumphs over Evolution?

The Bible not only tells us how we got here, it answers the question of where we are going! Does Evolution? In fact how many people care about the past more than the future? How many people worry about the past more than the future? Yet the Bible addresses the future more than the past, while Evolutionist are stuck trying to tell you about how you got here but gives no hope for what truly concerns us at our core!

Read God's answer, or questions to Job beginning
At Job chapter 38...
Then Jehovah answered Job out of the windstorm:
2 “Who is this who is obscuring my counsel
And speaking without knowledge?+
3 Brace yourself, please, like a man;
I will question you, and you inform me.
4 Where were you when I founded the earth?
Tell me, if you think you understand.
5 Who set its measurements, in case you know,
Or who stretched a measuring line across it?

Job 38

 
black 2017-10-06 08:05:15 

In reply to Norm


Naw! Men brought fire, weapons, the wheel, agriculture, cooking, etc, with them from chimpkind to mankind as they evolved. They built the pyramids, invented writing and math, made paper and gunpowder, etc, entirely by fluke.


Ok, you can go back a few thousand years where none of that existed, (with the exception of fire) just like the internet didn't exist 40 years ago. Mankind's intelligence and knowledge has progressed through the years or we would all be living in caves.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 08:20:59 

In reply to black

Yeah? How much evolution has occurred since Jesus was on earth?

Evolutionist claim that this phenomena happens extremely slowly so that generations can't see it!

But you yourself just show how much life has changed in just 40 years! How long has it been since a few bright minds figured out a few concepts that has set in motion the industrial age that has given us what we see today? Were these laws and the opportunity for them to be discovered not available in the time of the Egyptian Empire?

Did these laws only come into existence when they were discovered? What evolutionary process caused it to be discovered at the time it was and not centuries prior? And what evolutionary leap caused this Age of tech that was not available 200 years ago?

 
black 2017-10-06 08:33:23 

In reply to Ayenmol

But you yourself just show how much life has changed in just 40 years! How long has it been since a few bright minds figured out a few concepts that has set in motion the industrial age that has given us what we see today? Were these laws and the opportunity for them to be discovered not available in the time of the Egyptian Empire?


It is a slow process, computers go back as far as the 1700s, the internet didn't just fall out of the skies. And some things are invented but takes decades to perfect, it's all a process.

 
black 2017-10-06 08:37:32 

In reply to pelon

In great detail and over many years. You may even remember, at this is one example, my detail analysis of the timelines of creation, as per Genesis.

The foolish assumptions made is that if you don't believe, you must not of investigated, or read or spent half your life in church.


Exactly. They might even be able to make a stronger case for religion, if they did some investigating.

 
doosra 2017-10-06 08:41:52 

A brief history of humankind by yuval noah harari is a fantastic read

if you can read beyond 140 characters I have a copy

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 08:57:47 

Another reason outside of simply going by scripture, on which to reason as to belief in the Bible...If these men simply made up God and tried to use him as a way to control others, why are there so many accounts of these men themselves failing?
Moses, failed and was not allowed to reach the promised land! Yet he wrote many books of the Bible and it was to him that God gave the account of creation!
David, had many failings including putting a man to death to hide his affair with the man's wife!

Peter, Paul...Paul oversaw the stoning of Stephen, a faithful disciple of Christ!
Paul wrote that he prayed to God to remove a thorn in his flesh but that prayer was not answered!

Throughout the entire Bible all these writers sought to deceive, yet not one of them wrote about themselves as being without faults? Not one of them over 1600 years elevated themselves above others? Not one of them even for a moment wrote some sort of hubris that can be easily disputed today? Not one of them allowed the prevailing attitudes of the world around them to seep into their writing?

Today you see men who claim to be servants of God who have the Bible and yet are deceiving others. They make mistakes and never own up to them! They do not confess unless caught! Afterwards claim they have been forgiven and continue in their selfish course with no recourse for their Deeds!

Yet the men who wrote the Bible NEVER did that! Why? Everyone of them wrote the mistakes they made and how they were disciplined by God for it!

That does not reflect the thinking of man! Not even in those times!

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 09:03:43 

In reply to black

Is that not the point? Man has been learning from the time of Creation, and every new concept he learns opens up his mind to laws governing his surroundings that he can tap into! But has there been in any way a connection between a stage of evolution and a particular new concept being learned due to that physical evolution?
As Runs put it, when the homo sapiens mated with whoever, did that next evolved species immediately or within a particular timeframe develop or advance the knowledge that existed prior?

 
bravos 2017-10-06 09:39:51 

Familiar?

Allyuh have rel time lol,I heading south...

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 09:45:00 

Consider King Solomon. Solomon was given as a gift the opportunity to choose what he wanted post as a blessing. He chose wisdom and an obedient heart to govern God's people! Yet not only did Jehovah grant Solomon this wisdom he also gave him riches and glory because of Solomon's humble request!

Yet even so Solomon still went against the laws God gave Israel and chose wives from among the Nations!
Eventually he turned away from serving God!

It highlights that no matter what we are given by God or what pleasure he may take in us, if we do not stick to his laws we will fall away from that approved State.
It also highlights that just because we are wise or even receive a blessing from Jehovah, it does not make us infallible. And God does not will us to follow him, that decision always lie with us!

He blesses those who listen, not necessarily materially, but we lose his favor when we err.

 
pelon 2017-10-06 10:26:40 

In reply to Ayenmol

That is so beautiful, all that you typed.

Very effective tool for sure - it really forces me to reflect on the path I am on, and make me reconsider accepting anything but what is in the bible blindly.
Afterall, if I don't accept, I am going to be scorned by my community. I am going to be avoided by my friends... worse when I die, I will go to hell. The lord will judge me at THE GATES OF HEAVEN. Oh dear lord no. Please do not send me to Hell.
I thank you Ayenmol for bringing me back it to the bright light of knowledge and wisdom of Solomon, that which is Godly. Thank you Savior. I will abandon ever questioning HIS WILL, and follow the path of the word as explicitly written in the gospels.

Thank you Ayenmol.


What bullshit! Preaching gospel as science and science as gospel. NO FACKING scientist thinks science is gospel!!!
Ayenmol relentless quest: self-fulfillment. This is exactly what makes crusaders feel empowered. They "claimed a lost soul", while selfishly protecting themselves from a mythology.
The bible is a beautiful document but it is NOT a document to explain the science of creation. That does not discredit the bible, it simply puts it in context

 
black 2017-10-06 10:29:32 

In reply to pelon

lol lol lol

 
Runs 2017-10-06 11:14:26 

A belief in evolution is almost inconsistent with a belief in a privileged human soul (theism's 'cosmological constant' requiring a God). It suggests that, at some recent and arbitrary point in history 'God' intervened and inserted a soul in humans. That makes no sense (nor does a 'loving' interventionist creator). What makes more sense is that there is, ultimately, just one 'soul' or 'ground of being' or 'substrate consciousness' and that we are all aspects of it and profoundly interconnected. An eternal 'soul' almost requires a creationist perspective but that is contradicted by the clear evidence of evolution.

 
doosra 2017-10-06 11:16:25 

In that Debate i think it was ...Peter Hitchens asked an interesting question

i paraphrase

why is it wrong to consider an alternative universe from the scientific

i think it's an interesting question

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 11:17:52 

In reply to pelon

The bible is a beautiful document but it is NOT a document to explain the science of creation. That does not discredit the bible, it simply puts it in context


Except that is not fact. That is simply your quantifying something that you have determine you do not want to conform to.
You are unable to dispute what i said. You are unable to dispute the inique approach and wisdom of the Bible and how there is no other like it. Not even other so called divine writings are comparable to it!
you know that but you do not ask yourself why? You do not care to search why.

Because it is Gospel. You dont want gospel. Science does not judge you, Evolution allows you to do exactly what the Bible tells you your Creator says is futile. So you prfer that which allows your conscience to be clear...although it is not clear...but you fight it. That is why you all just cant stand Religion and the thought of others who hold you accountable by it.

Do you notice that all of you on here preaching evolution share that same thread? Fear of being judged?

BTW...The Bible says that when we die we go to the grave, not heaven or Hell...

Eccl. 9:5, 10: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all . . . All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol,* the place to which you are going.”


There are two words used in the bible that modern translators render as "hell". Hebrew word She'ohl and Greek Hai'des. That is it! Some translators transliterate these as "HELL", "THE GRAVE", "WORLD OF THE DEAD". Those words simply refer to the common grave!
One other word that was used by Jesus was the Greek "ge en·na" which Jesus used to signify eternal Destruction.

Ps. 146:4: “His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts* do perish


Job 14:13, Dy: “[Job prayed:] Who will grant me this, that thou mayst protect me in hell,* and hide me till thy wrath pass, and appoint me a time when thou wilt remember me?”


Was job asking that God torment him in Hell? No. Job was suffering and was willing to die to ESCAPE this suffering...why would he want to go to a place of torment to escape what he was going through?

Rom. 6:7: “He who has died has been acquitted from his sin.”

Why would there be another judgment if the dead is acquitted of his sin...or has paid the penalty for sin?


Nowhere in the Bible does it share a hope that people who die with God's favor go to a gate in heaven to be judged...

John 4
13 Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man.


Keep in mind Jesus lived after David Abraham, Enoch (who the Bible said was taken by God and some associate that to mean he was taken to Heaven) and many other faithful men many of whom wrote or were written about in the Bible. But Jesus said not one of them entered heaven prior to his coming to earth. So where are they?

So much of what you are saying are simply different versions of what you believe. Falsehood!

So if you do not understand the Scriptures and want to tout Evolution that is your perogative, but don't associate me with Pagan beliefs and pass it off as Bible teachings.

 
pelon 2017-10-06 11:22:06 

Ayenmol, cut all the sideshow bullshit, let us investigate 'facts' as written:

This thread is about Mythic explanation compared to a scientific explanation.

Do you believe that man came from soil/clay, and woman came from the rib of man, as documented in Genesis?

Yes or No.

I am no Oracle, but I am pretty sure you accept that story in Genesis as a FACT.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 11:23:18 

In reply to pelon

yEs! I believe the Bible's Creation account 100%.

 
black 2017-10-06 11:30:57 

In reply to pelon

lol lol lol


yEs! I believe the Bible's Creation account 100%


Yuh see he put ah small "y".

 
pelon 2017-10-06 11:32:16 

In reply to Ayenmol


I believe the Bible's Creation account 100%.


Ok, I respect that.

#humblethyself: my disposition and opinion is irrelevant and meaningless in the grand scheme.

I neither seek to change your faith based beliefs, nor do I seek to disrespect religious based explanations. They work well, and on many levels for MOST. ALL I ever do is ADD to the dialogue additional information - outside the bible.
You have the one and only document YOU will ever need: "the word of god". Big up.

Take comfort in your faith and wisdom and PROSPER in the good deeds of your heart.

 
bravos 2017-10-06 12:55:18 

Had to post this on the road as it may be relevant to the current angle of the argument,just simple rationale

Very short and sweet.

 
Norm 2017-10-06 13:49:07 

In reply to pelon
Faith is required BECAUSE proof is not always possible. It is equally dogmatic to believe that science could prove anything.

The main pillars of modern day science cannot be proven and therefore have to be taken on faith and circumstantial evidence, which makes science a competing system of faith with religion.

The structure of atoms, the existence of black holes, Einstein's theory of relativity, etc, cannot be proven - generally because of the limitations of human senses. Yet we generally accept conclusions based on what we could only assume to be an approximate truth at best.

Ultimately, faith is a requirement for human progress. The notion that science is absolute truth that is devoid of faith is itself absolute fiction!

Religion urges faith in matters related to the interaction of intelligent creatures exercising free will - a matter that computer science is now starting to grapple with - in the area of artificial intelligence.

 
pelon 2017-10-06 14:02:37 

In reply to Norm

Don't take the quantum leap from "made from Clay" to "Artificial Intelligence" supported only by the bible.

Ultimately, faith is a requirement for human progress.
agree*
Faith as YOU define it is FAITH in a process (any and all).
Faith as Religious Zealots define it is a belief in the exclusive evidence of the bible. Faith for them is a spiritual commitment.
This dichotomy - though clear - has been precluded from the dialog here.

Faith scientific discovery has a completely different context than Ayenmol's faith. His discovery is SEALED.

 
Ninetenjack 2017-10-06 14:21:03 

In reply to Ayenmol


yEs! I believe the Bible's Creation account 100%.


You shouldn't sweat religion and science so much, it shouldn't be an either or situation. It's my profound belief that one day science will prove some components of religion to be accurate and absolutely true.

For me the bible is written in parables so one should guard against literal interpretations. Didn't Jesus himself say I have many more things to teach you but you are not ready. Certain things will be revealed in time, as society through the massive infusion of technology becomes more accepting and aware.

The most important thing to have in these times is an open mind that will allow you to accept discussions, debates and ultimately discover new things.

I believe in evolution.... big grin...my thinking and positions on various subjects are constantly evolving.

 
black 2017-10-06 17:13:42 

In reply to Ayenmol

A little off topic but why are some pastor crooks? Isn't the word strong enough to keep them honest? They cannot plea ignorance, they know the bible inside out.

 
Runs 2017-10-06 17:18:45 

In reply to black

They do not see themselves as crooks, they find scripture that allows their behavior. Be they an Imam, Pastor or Pundit.

 
black 2017-10-06 17:24:49 

In reply to Runs

They do not see themselves as crooks, they find scripture that allows their behavior. Be they an Imam, Pastor or Pundit


Even when the bible clearly says not to commit adultery and not to steal?

The Quran might be different on marriage.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 18:04:20 

In reply to Ninetenjack
1 Kings 18...

21 Then E·lijah approached all the people and said: “How long will you be limping between two different opinions?* If Jehovah is the true God, follow him; but if Baʹal is, follow him!” But the people did not say a word in answer to him.


Exodus 20...
5 You must not bow down to them nor be enticed to serve them, for I, Jehovah your God, am a God who requires exclusive devotion, bringing punishment for the error of fathers upon sons, upon the third generation and upon the fourth generation of those who hate me,


Wishy washy has no place in service to God.

Philippians 1:...
10 that you may make sure of the more important things, so that you may be flawless and not stumbling others up to the day of Christ

Do you say to your wife, am just hanging with you until a better woman comes along? No! You fall in love and you commit! That is what service to God requires.
As the Creator that is what he deserves!

 
nickoutr 2017-10-06 18:07:40 

In reply to Ayenmol
amen to that!!! and all your posts on this tread
smile

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 18:10:24 

In reply to black

2 Timothy 3:...

13 But wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse, misleading and being misled.


1 Timothy 4...
4 However, the inspired word* clearly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to misleading inspired statements* and teachings of demons,


Revelation 12:..
9 So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him.


Revelation 20:...
10 And the Devil who was misleading them was hurled into the lake of fire and sulfur, where both the wild beast and the false prophet already were; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-06 18:46:11 

In reply to Norm

Faith is required BECAUSE proof is not always possible. It is equally dogmatic to believe that science could prove anything


I think you mean everything.
How would science have proven gravity without knowing it's effect?

They still do not understand exactly what electricity is!

The wind, they know is moving air, but they do not know why it is here.

The Bible says the Heavens declare the Glory of God, and the work of His hands the expanse is telling.
How are we able to not see these things but understand they exist? Because we "see" their effect!
We also see the effect that God has. We see it in his Word. We see it in ourselves when we apply his word. We see it in others who apply his word.

We see it in the prophecies fulfilled and being fulfilled. We see it in the state of affairs today that was prophesied about!
So no, we do not see Jehovah, but like the other things he created that we can't see, we feel his presence!

Not one concept that is the embodiment of the THEORY of evolution can be, or has been duplicated, replicated, demonstrated or quantatively seen in this World! Star trek is more believable than Evolution, a piecing together of oddities in fossils with the imaginative mind of eccentric people.

We know and Science proves that there are forces we cannot see, touch or taste that is all around us and affect our lives... Yet we find it so hard to believe that among those is a Supreme Being?

Whereas not one concept of the big bang or Evolution Theory outside of a designer can be seen in anything we know or can prove...but it's the belief in God that is farfetched?

Amazing!

 
black 2017-10-07 08:48:17 

In reply to Ayenmol

How could God have created the infinite Universe? It always existed, everything else came after.

All forces/energy in the universe is physical, it is impossible to wish something and make it happen. There is not a spiritual force, at least it has not been demonstrated or proven.

How could God exist everywhere in an infinite universe?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-07 10:17:37 

In reply to black

How could God have created the infinite Universe? It always existed, everything else came after.
How could God exist everywhere in an infinite universe?


Am not sure how you are forming your mouth to make those statements ... The Bible does not say how much of the "Universe" Jehovah created. But it does say he created Heaven and Earth. Am not going to sit here and argue how that is because i do not know. But for you to claim you know is quite disengenuous.

All forces/energy in the universe is physical, it is impossible to wish something and make it happen. There is not a spiritual force, at least it has not been demonstrated or proven.


Umm again am not sure where you getthe authority to make such blanket statements! It does not compute to your thoughts on evolution. Everything we know has a start somewhere. Everything we know and interact with is of a physical nature.

But we do not know where they come from...Evolution does not explain them at all! How is it that earth is the only planet that has breathable air? How is it that air does not escape into space? Am not asking the physical how, but the reason why these laws that govern them exist.

You Evolutionist claim that we evolved to adapt to our surroundings...does air have dna? a mind to decide what is best for it? what was it about the Earth that made it "evolve" to where it saw the need to develop a gravitational pull to keep things in it's atmosphere that makes life possible? Is it aware of other Planets not having these things and fearful that they may take away it's precious assets?

We may not understand how God can be omnipresent...but we do have things that are not "physical" in many ways, that are! Gravity! Electricity! Air! How are these things everywhere around us? How are they able to affect everything on Earth while we PHYSICAL beings can only affect things we have a hold of?

We have many things right here on Earth that behave in a manner equal to what God has presented himself as being. But nothing that does what Evolution purport or exizt in inanimate things the way they do in living things that evolutionist claim spurs this mutation among the living.

Evolution answers none of these things. And the mere fact that you would call yourself a Scientific person while making blanket statements of things that are yet to be proven either way? hmm.

Shows your motive i think.

 
black 2017-10-07 10:28:44 

In reply to Ayenmol

.. The Bible does not say how much of the "Universe" Jehovah created. But it does say he created Heaven and Earth
.

What exactly is heaven?


You Evolutionist claim that we evolved to adapt to our surroundings...does air have dna? a mind to decide what is best for it? what was it about the Earth that made it "evolve" to where it saw the need to develop a gravitational pull to keep things in it's atmosphere that makes life possible?


Isn't there a simple explanation for gravitational force?

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-07 10:46:35 

In reply to black

Isn't there a simple explanation for gravitational force?


There is...But where did this law come from?

There are laws governing light, speed. sound etc that are the same on Earth as they are in space...(dont bother argue sound and space)yet only earth has Air and Gravity but they do not preceed the laws in Space...ie. even with the extra laws of physics on Earth it does not interfere with the laws affecting these same features in space. Why? Unless there was collaboration of some kind why is it that the laws on Earth that govern life work in harmony with forces outside our realm and perfectly utilize these?

How does Newton's law equate in the Big Bang by the way? How is it that a force so strong to cause all the perfect conditions for life on Earth did not spill even a tiny bit onto Venus or Mars?

What of the moon? How did it form? Why do moons only revolve around individual Planets? While Suns solar Systems? Was there a force independent of the big bang that went around organizing these things so that all over the Universe they all interact with each other the same way?

 
black 2017-10-07 11:16:01 

In reply to Ayenmol


There are laws governing light, speed. sound etc that are the same on Earth as they are in space...(dont bother argue sound and space)yet only earth has Air and Gravity but they do not preceed the laws in Space...ie. even with the extra laws of physics on Earth it does not interfere with the laws affecting these same features in space. Why? Unless there was collaboration of some kind why is it that the laws on Earth that govern life work in harmony with forces outside our realm and perfectly utilize these?


Isn't that what makes the earth unique? Maybe that explains why there is life on earth and not on other KNOWN planets.


Why do moons only revolve around individual Planets? While Suns solar Systems? Was there a force independent of the big bang that went around organizing these things so that all over the Universe they all interact with each other the same way?


Our moon is basically held captive by our planet. The structure of the universe has to do with size and mass, the sun would be too massive to be held captive by a planet.

 
Ayenmol 2017-10-07 11:52:05 

In reply to black

Our moon is basically held captive by our planet. The structure of the universe has to do with size and mass, the sun would be too massive to be held captive by a planet.


I like how you answer without answering. Just a response to claim response but no substance.

I guess the only reason the sun is not held captive by a Planet is because of size. Are there any Planets out there bigger than our Sun? Do they hold any suns hostage? What holds the other Planets in place where they are?

If it was all a matter of chance does it not stand to reason that each Planet and solar system would have it's own laws? Yet no matter where you go the same laws govern them all...seems like Design to me!

Since the same laws are present in this vast Universe, why has the big bang not replicated itself any where else in these billions of solar systems? Or are they too young to be affected by this once in a trillion occurrence?

 
pelon 2017-10-07 12:52:33 

In reply to Ayenmol

You can play around in a sandbox of pseudoscience all afternoon. But at some point, you will get sand in your eyes.

Few here will waste time to pluck out your nonsense.

yet only earth has Air and Gravity

1. THAT is not factual. You should know better. (You are getting like BatQuake/ToldUso now.)

Why do moons only revolve around individual Planets? While Suns solar Systems?

2. Gravity is the force that keeps planets in orbit around the Sun. Black is correct about mass/density, size as factors for positional orbit.
3. Moons are not around every planet. Mars has two, Venus has none. Our solar system is not the ONLY solar system.

Importantly, the solar system has many moons, a fact not acknowledged in the bible.
The bible mentions the word 'moon' 51 times. First is Genesis 37:9, last in Revelation 21:23
EVERY time throughout the entire bible the word moon is SINGULAR. Not once, not one single time is the word "moons" used in the bible. This is due to the observations of man at the time, and therefore NOT the word of god a creator...

Conversely, the bible mentions the word 'stars' 51 times. First in Genesis 1:16, last in Revelation 12:4 Each time 'stars' are mentioned it is reflective of the observations of man.

why has the big bang not replicated itself

4. The 'big bang' is a singular event. To put it in layman's (like pelon) terms: a single stick of dynamite can only explode ONCE. The forces that create the explosion themselves expire BECAUSE of the explosion. The big bang is a scientific explanation of the birth of the universe. UNLIKE the word of your god, it is not gospel. It changes as new details are revealed via robust investigation.

5. The bible did a WOEFUL job dating the age of earth, listing it as being less than 8000 years old. (timelines in Genesis).

So Ayenmol, as I respect your potent defense of the bible - try and be open-minded. A single document can never be the only source of knowledge.

 
Norm 2017-10-07 17:20:39 

In reply to black

How could God have created the infinite Universe? It always existed, everything else came after.
...
How could God exist everywhere in an infinite universe?

Very valid questions, in my opinion. This is where I diverge from those who defend the scriptures for religious purposes. I defend the scriptures as being man-made documents of enormous social and historical value - not necessarily accurate, but still containing valuable snapshots of man's condition and thoughts at the time the scriptures were written.

Much of what specific religions state cannot be traced back directly to the scriptures themselves. Opinions such as "Jesus is God" cannot be traced back to anything Jesus said (in the scriptures). Neither can "God created everything in existence" and "God is everywhere" be traced back to God's own words.

Another statement that causes huge problems for those defending scriptures for religious purposes is "The scriptures were inspired by God". Such an opinion places the blame for the contradictions in the scriptures on God, and leads to nonsensical defenses, such as "God knows best" and "We humans cannot comprehend God's reasons."

I believe that the value of ancient literature could only be derived by reading with unbiased (scientific) eyes - without bias either for or against the material being studied. In the case of the scriptures, the task is made really difficult by the enormous amount of biased opinions for and against.

 
black 2017-10-09 10:29:45 

In reply to Norm


Much of what specific religions state cannot be traced back directly to the scriptures themselves. Opinions such as "Jesus is God" cannot be traced back to anything Jesus said (in the scriptures). Neither can "God created everything in existence" and "God is everywhere" be traced back to God's own words.


You do realize that this is the basis for Christianity right?

This leaves you in agnostic territory.

 
Norm 2017-10-09 11:31:29 

Do you think a lawyer always believes his client is innocent?

One's conclusion from available evidence isn't necessarily what one believes.

And, it's not the judge that is on trial.
And, is some label like "agnostic" supposed to define someone?

And is that what you got out of all of this discussion? Which part of Bernice you said you were from again? Canje head?

smile

 
black 2017-10-09 11:52:36 

In reply to Norm

Do you think a lawyer always believes his client is innocent?


Not always, but they have a duty to represent their clients. Lawyers are not in the morality business. The burden is on the State to prove guilt.

One's conclusion from available evidence isn't necessarily what one believes
.

True, but you must have had questions, to venture outside of that belief, at least you are thinking.

I used the word "agnostic" to show that your thinking is not in the mainstream. Only you know where your belief system lies.

And is that what you got out of all of this discussion? Which part of Bernice you said you were from again? Canje head?


I am not from Berbice, used to visit Black Bush as a kid though.