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HEADLINE: 'IPL Stars Should Not Walk Back Into Test Team'
CaribbeanCricket.com
2015-05-22 06:55:32
Cricket great Curtly Ambrose doesn't believe the West Indies' Indian Premier League (IPL) players should walk back into the Test team.
"For me, I think not," he said yesterday at Lord's. He was there to attend the first test between England and New Zealand, and promote his new autobiography, Time to Talk.
"Not disrespecting the players who have gone to the IPL, but you can't really decide to go away, and walk straight back into the team. For me, that's a concern."
Ambrose was brought into the West Indies staff by then-coach Ottis Gibson a year ago as, of course, a bowling coach, and has been retained by Phil Simmons, who took over in March.
Full Story
cricketest
2015-05-22 07:45:36
Ambrose was brought into the West Indies staff by then-coach Ottis Gibson a year ago as, of course, a bowling coach, and has been retained by Phil Simmons, who took over in March.
that should answer a few questions.
FanAttick
2015-05-22 08:32:19
In reply to cricketest
He sympathised with players who stayed home to play for the West Indies, and were doing OK. He added the talent was there to be a top team again noting that "from time to time I see some brilliance", insisting they just needed more confidence and self-belief.
I agree with Ambrose.
The players who rejected IPL contracts should get first crack at test selection....
FuzzyWuzzy
2015-05-22 09:30:24
Cleg
2015-05-22 09:34:55
Cuter
2015-05-22 09:35:22
Its the obvious position to take.
the current set of players have received moderate success and they should be rewarded for their sacrifice and had work.
cant just drop them to accommodate IPl players
Cuter
2015-05-22 09:35:47
In reply to Cleg
Darren Bravo did
eric365
2015-05-22 09:38:27
In reply to FanAttick
On the money!! But it is Ambrose who is speaking. We must remember that!!
Cleg
2015-05-22 09:42:44
Seams like,once you go anywhere near the WICB...
...YOU COME AWAY WITH SOME KIND OF VIRUS OR CANCER!
Mickey was lucky to walk away before he got infected!
FuzzyWuzzy
2015-05-22 10:16:18
In reply to Cleg
Because Mikey is all talk no action
sunfish
2015-05-22 10:17:50
Ambrose is right about this one. How can they, the IPLers, be allowed to walk back into the team at the expense of the ones who stayed at home and did the 4 day PCL??
jballer84
2015-05-22 10:29:54
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
I don't understand why this is even being discussed as none of the IPL players are great test cricketers. Russell I believe could develop into a really good test player, and take test matches away like Adam Gilchrist did in the lower middle order. Narine when bowling well, and maybe Simmons in the middle order.
Dwayne Bravo was a decent test player, but his batting looks woeful at the moment. I'm sure he can perform at the test level if he puts some work in and play some consistent first class cricket, but will that happen? No way he can make the team with no performances behind him.
Ewart
2015-05-22 13:04:37
Emir
2015-05-22 17:38:20
Ambrose is free to voice his opinion and it is only his opinion. Gladly he is not the coach as the coaches' plan make better sense.
It is dumb to split and try to wedge players between IPL players and non IPL players.
Ambrose gets tongue tied, like many others when they speak with their former masters.
sunfish
2015-05-22 18:03:28
In reply to Emir
Ambrose is not the coach but Simmons is not the full selection panel either. Maybe he, Simmons, does not understand that he has less power than he thinks, especially when West Indian cricket politics is considered.
Emir
2015-05-22 18:29:34
In reply to sunfish
Come man, act mature and like an adult- Simmons was well within his crease to say what he said whereas Ambrose bowled a no ball.
archangel
2015-05-22 18:58:13
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
Totally agree with Ambrose's sentiments but not necessarily is reported reason.
T20 and Test and very different so one can't use lick it cricket to determine a Test place.
The players should prove themselves in the longer format to earn a place in Test. I have no issues with them getting into the T20 or even 50 overs team.
imusic
2015-05-22 19:07:25
In reply to archangel
What did Gabriel do to "prove himself in the longer format to earn a place in Test?"
What did Sammy do when he was playing?
Simply play regional cricket? If so, why aren't Theophile, Kneroy Peters, Matthew, Dowrich, etc not on the WI team?
archangel
2015-05-22 19:49:32
In reply to imusic
So it has been done and is being done so why not continue?
Fair point.
Still doesn't say it is right though.
imusic
2015-05-22 20:44:53
In reply to archangel
Bravo, Pollard, Narine, Russell, and Simmons are ALL...without exception...among the best CRICKETERS in the region...regardless of format.
openning
2015-05-22 21:27:41
It is a myth for anyone to think four of the five players playing together will add any value to a test or ODI team.
These four players are all the same, would you be able to bowl any of them after tea during a test match?
Will they be able to bat out two full sessions?
In T20 they are used as Power hitters, only Simmons bats in a normal batting slot.
We have try this combination before, it like playing four players in the #6 spot.
imusic
2015-05-22 21:33:20
In reply to openning
would you be able to bowl any of them after tea during a test match?
Will they be able to bat out two full sessions?
The first question is asinine
How many overs constitute 2 full sessions?
openning
2015-05-22 22:11:55
In reply to imusic
There are 90 overs a day per test,more overs are bowl in the two sessions before Tea, than in any other format
Chally1
2015-05-22 22:17:57
Both sides must work together to make this work. We can use Simmons, Narine and Bravo but only if they are committed to the team...
Besar
2015-05-22 23:20:26
In reply to Cleg
Ambrose is neither anti IPL players nor infected by some 'pro WICB virus'; it is more likely that being in the kitchen, he is now feeling the heat. It is a matter of team dynamics; you can't just have some players walk in and out of the team at will. It will be disruptive to team spirit, and Phil Simmons would end up in the same position as Ottis if he does not get these players to commit themselves and be available at all times for the West Indies.
No one is against these guys playing IPL and other T20 tournaments to make money; all other players in the world do it, except that they all make themselves available for their countries. Unless Phil Simmons can get the full commitment of these players to ensure the stability of the team, he will in a couple years be singing the same tune like Ambrose.
anandgb
2015-05-22 23:54:18
In reply to Besar
Unless Phil Simmons can get the full commitment of these players to ensure the stability of the team, he will in a couple years be singing the same tune like Ambrose.
I mean no disrespect for the coach here, but lookit he played 26 test matches and averaged 22.26.
He has been an outstanding coach to the Irish team in LO cricket. No test matches.
To say he is out of his depth here may be in poor taste since it is too soon to gauge.
But I wonder about this, especially since it is coming so soon after Dwayne Bravo indicated he is considering a return to the longer format of the game after Simmons became the coach.
It is also worthy to note of the 5 IPLers he talking about Gayle & Russel already claimed that their bodies cannot stand the strain of test cricket.
Pacy
2015-05-22 23:57:16
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
Interesting that the same posters who supported the Previous coach who selected U19, CCC and Fringe players in the WI team are against even considering players who had proved themselves in one format globally...
All the so called Players have been representing WI team everytime they were selected but there is a myth that is perpetuated that they choose T20 League over International cricket.
Babylon
2015-05-22 23:57:38
In reply to anandgb
more like dem pocket cyaant stand the strain of test cricket
Pacy
2015-05-23 00:18:51
In reply to anandgb
I mean no disrespect for the coach here, but lookit he played 26 test matches and averaged 22.26.
He has been an outstanding coach to the Irish team in LO cricket. No test matches.
To say he is out of his depth here may be in poor taste since it is too soon to gauge.
Thing about Phil I am seeing is that he seems to be a good people manager... He is not animated, puts his arms around the players and not controversial.
When every coach so far has come in with an agenda and gave speeches on how WI players are unfit, Incompetent etc he has come in saying that he has a good team to work with.
Even when the team lost in the second test against England, he still maintained that his team did well in the most part of the test and only messed up in one session. He was sure his team will overcome that. Team did respond properly next test.
Even now, he might talk to all the 5 guys and they might say the same things like body not fit to play longer duration. I see only Bravo might be close to selection. Still it sends the right signals to the team. Accept or not the team was and is close to the IPL stars. It is evident during the India standoff. While WICB and their supporters are successful in Making Bravo the Scapegoat, the entire team was behind him and there is every chance that some might have the bad taste of that episode.
This approach would actually bring him closer to the entire team. Who knows? None of the 5 might have a look in at the test side but this dialogue could go a long way in create a trust based environment.
It is important to be fair in a team environment and Build Trust. I am feeling a lot better having Simmo as the coach
anandgb
2015-05-23 02:02:08
In reply to Pacy
All the so called Players have been representing WI team everytime they were selected but there is a myth that is perpetuated that they choose T20 League over International cricket.
Myth? Boy you really not paying attention.
Pacy
2015-05-23 03:58:44
In reply to anandgb
So show me where anyone was selected and they rejected their selection for the WI team?
That would clearly show who is not paying attention and how the Myth is slowly becoming a fact
jballer84
2015-05-23 18:53:19
In reply to Pacy
Gayle and Narine have made themselves unavailable for selection, so of course they have not been selected, so never had to refuse.
Russell said he's not fit for test, probably would have been selected.
Pollard and Bravo to my knowledge never made themselves unavailable or refuse selection. They are looked at as limited overs players it seems.
My thoughts - Gayle should be retired from Test, and he should probably quit ODI as well.
Narine is a Judas and should look into himself and decide what he wants going forward.
Bravo and Pollard can get back into the fold, but they need to put a bit more work into cricket and play more first class games. Perhaps get county contracts, but they both need to learn batting more than 5 overs again.
POINT
2015-05-23 19:34:38
I believe that Some People do not want them to be on the Team , because that would mess up their Agenda .
brians_da_best
2015-05-24 02:32:57
In reply to Pacy
Pacy, these guys have all ruled themselves out of tests, so they can play IPL. Hence, they are not even considered for selection.
So, technically, yes you're right. they have never said no to test selection to play in the IPL.
What they do is make themselves unavailable for selection, and go to IPL
Pacy
2015-05-24 04:11:49
In reply to brians_da_best
Pacy, these guys have all ruled themselves out of tests, so they can play IPL. Hence, they are not even considered for selection.
Another Myth. Russel and Simmons have done that this season. But before this only Gayle because of his injury (Whihc is a fact) had stayed away at times.
What they do is make themselves unavailable for selection, and go to IPL
That is a phenomenon that was seen during the recent series. But not in the past. For long WICB had denied selection for Players in IPL by creating a smoke screen that they are uncommitted.
If you go back to Chris Gayle's Selection in RCB for the first time (2010 or 11 I think) none of the WI players were selected since the WICB tour coincided with IPL. But after the auction, all these players were Dropped stating their commitment and WI cricket moving new direction. Gayle was then got as a replacement player by RCB for 200K only for him to succeed and become a regular fixture.
So the players making themselves unavailable is the recent trend (Russel / Narine) who had seen the way WI Cricket operates and they are just one question away from being victimised.
So, technically, yes you're right. they have never said no to test selection to play in the IPL.
I know I am right. Players whenever selected left all their T20 commitments and played for WI. But WICB and its supporters claim that the players only are committed to the T20 cricket which is far from the fact.
Pacy
2015-05-24 04:22:45
In reply to jballer84
I am 100% with you.
My thoughts - Gayle should be retired from Test, and he should probably quit ODI as well.
I agree with the test part. But I think if Simmo can work with him and get the best in LO cricket he still can be an asset in the LO part.
Narine is a Judas and should look into himself and decide what he wants going forward.
100% with you. He is someone I will never back after his decision during the WC.
Bravo and Pollard can get back into the fold, but they need to put a bit more work into cricket and play more first class games. Perhaps get county contracts, but they both need to learn batting more than 5 overs again.
I would not put Bravo and Pollard in the same bracket. This it the same Bravo who scored centuries as recently as 2014 against better teams in LO cricket. Bravo can be effective in all formats of the game. He needs support and guidance.
With Pollard I agree with your assessment. Needs to prove a lot before he can be a regular feature.
Simmons is the next person I am looking at. While he is no world beater, he is now maturing into a good batsman. With WI not having a partner to go with KB he surely can be an option. It is for him to come into the fold and work closely with the team. Theophile, Chandrika are the other option but Simmons exposure across the world and International bowlers would be an added advantage.
All said and done more than any of these guys being selected I am happy that the "COACH" we have now is willing to work with players and not be a order taker from the management. Trust can go a long way in players giving their 100% for you.
mikesiva
2015-05-24 06:58:42
yes according to the Sunday times Gayle will be arriving in Somerset this week to play the NatWest t20 competition.
granite
2015-05-24 07:06:43
When,and if Sir Curtley Ambrose gets a million dollar contract in the IPL like Akram and Donald,I would like to hear him sermonize.