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and merge economies?

Right now, they have very little influence on the World stage , seems like it would be beneficial to speak as a single voice and help to shape World events. These little Countries are acting like they really do mean something.

In reply to black

that makes no sense on any level

In reply to sudden

Explain.

In reply to black

how big an economic bloc does the Caribbean represent in the global arena?

In reply to black

Our Caribbean governnments are way too parochial to do what the EU has done...just look at the way the Jamaican and Trini governments are cussing each other and threatening all sorts of boycotts.

In reply to black

These little countries do mean something, bitch!

In reply to sudden

A lot more than St Lucia represent. The only thing people know about the Dots, are vacations.

In reply to steveo

Why the ugly language? Just trying to have a discussion.

In reply to black

true but on a global level the entire Caribbean means zilch

In reply to black

It was earned

In reply to steveo

So, you think I am singling out one Country? All of them have disputes, from time to time. Right or wrong, the JA/Trini dispute, makes my point.

"If dey know dey en want Federation..."
Mighty Sparrow

Tried and failed. The concept sounds great but I doubt we can get past our crabs in a barrel mentality.

In reply to black

It's been done. It's called the West Indies Cricket Board or "WICB". A distinguished institution and a model of competence and bureaucratic efficiency for the rest of the world.

In reply to SnoopDog

You and I don't disagree about much but those guys should have been disbanded years ago. It's not the concept, it the leadership.

In reply to black

Territories in the Caribbean Sea include Haiti, Cuba, Puerto Rico, Dominican Republic etc., along with the smaller islands that were once colonies of Britain, France, Holland and Spain.


If you are talking about such an all-inclusive union it makes sense. If not......


//

In reply to black

Based on the opinions of talk show callers and posters on social media, interestingly the majority of persons in both JA and T&T would consider following Bahamas example and leave Caricom for numerous reasons.

In reply to Slipfeeler

i think Ja would move out of the Caribbean if it could

In reply to sudden

State the reasons for your premise!

In reply to Slipfeeler

Jamaicans, it seems to me, look at the rest of the Caribbean as appendages and only useful if they served some larger purpose to Jamaica, e.g. trade or a place to send migrants. if that cant happen, then, Ja likes to say it derives no benefit from being part of the Caribbean community and Ja usually says it would be better to align itself with USA or Central or South America.

In reply to sudden

Ok I understand your point and it does make some sense. I think the geographical location of JA has influenced the mindset of some Jcans been closer to North America and Central America than even the rest of the Caribbean, despite the long history and cultural ties that exist between JA and the rest of the Caribbean. Truthfully Jcans until recently had no appetite or reasons to visit other islands and other islanders for the most part do not visit JA unless to attend school or in a cruise, so there have been a large disconnect between islands.

However, consider that Cuba is only 90 miles from JA that if you are high enough in a clear day, you could almost see Cuba but yet persons of both islands know very little about each other but many Cubans are now living in JA and vice versa.

There need to be more inter-island interactions to increase knowledge of respective islands and to reduce ignorance. I met friends from several islands while at UWI and we have become lifetime friends.

In reply to black

Jamaica Yes, Federation No.

One from 10 leaves zero.

That was already tried and rejected.

In reply to Drapsey

Was it fully implemented?

In reply to black

Yes, but Jamaica voted to withdraw, hence Dr Williams' utterance.

In reply to Drapsey

I know all that. Did they actually merged economies?

In reply to black

Bro, the peoples of the region are militantly nationalistic and tribal. It's why insularity permeates our cricket. With every passing generation the idea of a "Caribbean Man" or even the "West Indies" becomes more abstract. The shared history of slavery, indentured servitude and the struggle for equality and independence seems to be no longer relevant in today's world.

"Time for everyone to go it alone".

In reply to SnoopDog

It's really sad, but I got your drift.

Are we better off now?

In reply to black

Most of the old people in Guyana who lived in pre and post independence times say 'no'. They reflect fondly and nostalgically of better times during colonial rule.

It may come as a surprise to many here that the Eastern Caribbean Countries
have a single Currency , which I might add is higher in value that some other Countries .

The Legal System is fully integrated
it also has a Single Aviation Authority . The problem with the Regional as a whole is that some thing that they are big but in the whole scheme of things in the World they aint really Big , that is a mirage that they implanted in
their minds .

One of these days they will really find out that they like those they despise are in the same freaking Boat . I recall when the Federation existed , a Certain Country declared
publicly that they were putting in more money and getting less for doing that .

The Government of the Federation's Finance Minister was , Robert Bradshaw , who produced evidence that
dispelled that assertion .

Frankly in my opinion , ALL the Countries in the Region need to understand that they are ALL in the same freaking Boat , and the idea about talking who is big & who is a Dot aint helping those who claim that they are big .

Saying you are big and your currency is lower than others , in reality
suggests that you aint as big as you suggest . WE need to cutout all the B.S .

Countries that have fought bitter wars against each other , in Europe have seen the Wisdom to have a united
linkage . hence the European Common Market .

Yet in this Region , WE have people
who are blinded by their puny intellect , lack of Vision , and stark Pettiness . They love bragging about how they Big yet they have to run to the IMF .

I am really amused by these small minded People . In essence WE are
runnng very fast , but WE are still in the same freaking Place .

WE have to get rid of our Crabs in a Barrel Mentality . There is no reason why the Government of both Trinidad & Tobago & the Government of Jamaica , cannot sit down and have an intelligent conversation to solve the Problem that they have .

If that is not done it will demonstrate to all & sundry the paucity of their Intelligence .

In reply to POINT

Well said.

In reply to black

Thank You . In my opinion the Politicians in the Region love bragging about their Countries have this that & the other , but from an economical
perspective , they cannot make a freaking dent in the World .

They relish strutting about as Prime Minister this that & the other , meanwhile they running to the IMF for money . while talking about my Country is bigger & better than your Country . When the Truth is that they are all in the same freaking Boat .

In reply to POINT

maybe the rest of the countries should set up a federation and exclude this one outlier. Maybe then they will see the errors of their ways.

In reply to POINT

maybe the rest of the countries should set up a federation and exclude this one outlier. Maybe then they will see the errors of their ways.

In reply to POINT

The quoted statement is loaded with derisiveness and disdain. No wonder there is disunity.

In my humble opinion, Jamaica should focus on forming an economic zone with countries like Columbia, Panama, Costa Rica, Mexico, Cuba, Haiti, and the Dominican Republic (the Caribbean countries at our doorstep). Now that would be a powerful federation.

In reply to SnoopDog

From what I have heard Guyana seems to have been better off under Colonial rule.

In reply to NHu

Interesting. This comes up v often, almost in opposition to a union with the rest of the English speaking Caribbean. I wonder why it has never happened? Seems like a v good idea and would be of great benefit to Ja if not the other countries mentioned

Wouldn't happen because the socialists` mindset is that everything should be hard. They cannot keep things simple. Me seh suh n done!

Perhaps with the exception of Guyana
those who love to say that they are big ; in the World , they simply aint BIG in terms of Geographical size .

My perspective is that this is one of the sad things that WE inherited from
England , the Divide & Conquer modus operandi , WE have not yet disavowed that idea .

Some people who live in " Big Islands " think that it is beneath their sensibilities to learn or understand
the History of Islands in the Region
smaller than they are .

Some people in this Forum are derisive when I stated that in SVG
WE do not have a History of having
Cricket Clubs with Grounds & Clubhouses .

If they read the History of St. Vincent & the Grenadines , they would have realized that the Caribs , the original inhabitants of the Island fought Wars against the Caribs , until the British not only defeated them but were so afraid of their war like behaviour placed thousands of them in Warships and shipped them to Rouatan an Island off Central America .
Obviously these wars hampered the development of SVG , where places have English & French names . The French were in SVG , and the Caribs
had no problem with them they never proclaimed that they claimed the island for the King of France .

When the British came they stated that they claimed the island for the King of England . that did not go down well with the Paramount Chief of
the Caribs in SVG ;hence the Wars against the British .

It has been stated that when the Americans heard about Chatoyer and his battles against the British , that gave the Americans the courage
to fight the British for their Independence .

If in the Primary & Secondary Schools
The History of the English speaking Islands , this exercise , I believe
will help to foster the idea of Unity .
Many here may also be unaware of the fact that the idea of having Unity in the Region happened before the dawn of the West Indies Federation .

Marryshow of Grenada ; George Mc Intosh of SVG & Others had this in mind . So it aint is if the West Indies Federation was inventing the wheel .

In reply to NHu

In essence , what you propose would require the Jamaican population to learn Spanish & French also the mores of those Countries . Good Luck with that idea .

I don't have a problem with any country
that wants to align with other Countries that is their Right .

In reply to POINT


Both those languages are taught widely in the schools....


//

Here's what will upset most! Ask an Anglo or Sino windian of a single union n chances are, they are for it. Other ethnics in the region (chances) are, they aren't for it! Who`s vexed, be! Anyway, some lil chukuchuku territories with the same socio-polictical make up don't see the need for a simple single union. Go figure!

In reply to Ewart

I may be wrong , but it seems to me that there is a distinction between learning & speaking , the latter has all sorts of nuances .

However as I stated , who want to align with Tom ; Dick or Harry is their Right . But from a practical perspective,
my take is that doing that is much more heavier lifting , than aligning with Countries that you share the same language , System of Government
Judicial Heritage ; Education System
etc . That may also mean closing the UWI Campus , or making alterations .
However as I have stated already who wants to align with who , has a Right to do so .

In reply to POINT

Look at America and how the States came together after the brutally divisive Civil War, you will not see that in the the Caribbean because of establishment politics. The people in-change, cannot see, past their hold on power and how it benefits them, they don't have a sense of devotion to the people they were elected to represent.

You have to look at how it (union) is going to benefit everyone in the region. The reason Americans, are successful, is because there are no limitations between States, people are free to travel where their skills are required. I know some, might not see a parallel but, States in America are sovereign, even though they function as one Country.

In reply to black Whadam badam boom! Outstanding blacky!

In reply to black

To be honest, if it wasn't for west indies cricket, I don't think the caribbean would have been so dear to my heart. Because of my love for west indies, I automatically love the caribbean more than any other. Passionate about visiting all the caribbean islands before me time on this earth is done.

The truth is that there are many people in the region who believe we should have a complete Union and more than a few working to achieve this aim.

Most of you would be surprised at the deepening links across our region.

In reply to jen Precisely my fantasy - to visit each territory.

In reply to POINT

OECS is a very good example of what can be done. They are even buying needed drugs in bulk

In reply to Chrissy

One of the things that is admirable in the Region is that certified Professionals , can work in any Island
in the English speaking Region .

Nurses from SVG are currently employed
in Hospitals in Trinidad & Tobago ; also in Barbados . Certified Vincentian
Masons are employed in other Countries in the Region .

I also know that in the Eastern Caribbean Countries , professionals
from one Country , can fill vacancies
in that particular position , if there are vacancies in other Islands in the ECC .

In reply to black
Do you want to see a united criminal union between Trinidad and Jamaica,could you imagine that,don't think you can.

.

Caribbean Union

Once this man is the Leader of the Union eh

but yuh know dem yardies have too much pride for that to happen. Remember how much pride Bustamante had seeing how Dr Williams was running tingz in the federation he begged for JA to pull out

In reply to NHu

What I have stated are stark Facts , now if you believe that is derision
Stating facts can never be construed as being disdain ;that is your opinion , which you are entitled to express .

I also have a Right to express my opinion . I do not ever intend not expressing my opinions in this Forum .

In reply to Ewart

Learning the language is one thing; learning a culture is a totally different kettle of fish.