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good batsmen in this environment. It is obvious that nothing tried so far is working.

How can you start a professional league without preparing people to be professionals? So if you pay an amateur that makes him a professional! Is this the extent of the thinking of the people in the upper echelons of the West Indian society?

In reply to methodic

Paying them was just a move to divide and conquer. Politics.

That's what they interested in.. Not cricket results

In reply to methodic

Good question...and absolutely no appraisal system to inform the granting of any new or repeat contracts.

That's the WICB for you. And we are expecting improvements.

In reply to methodic

sometimes one just have to get started, and make adjustments along the way, our Pro league should have been started since the early 90s.
At least we have it now, the responsibility of turning their players "professional" rest in the hands of the franchise owners (territorial boards), they determine who they contract and hire as they coaching staff

In reply to hawk

And how are they held accountable...who holds them accountable...and what happens when they don't achieve their performance targets?

In reply to Courtesy

the framework for developing and measuring success rest in the hands of territorial boards or franchise owners, .......think of the CPL...who does it there, the CPL board cannot dictate which players the franchises select or be held accountable for their failures and/or success, organising and policing the tournament is all the CWI can do everything else rest in the hands of the franchise owners, they have to develop their team and provide the coaching needed for success and like any business because a franchise is a business, you make changes that would bring the returns you are looking for.
i am not sure we see our franchises as businesses we still thinking in terms of national teams and that they are accountable to the people...wrong they are accountable to the shareholders

In reply to hawk

Before I engage you...are you Jamaican?...needed for data collection purposes.



Do you understand the difference in structure between the CPL and PCL and who funds the two entities?

In reply to Courtesy

I am a Bajan (figured this was common knowledge)


the funding and personnel maybe different, but at its core they are both franchise based leagues, the PCL would be slower in development as a bonafide pro league but it will get there, certainly not overnight, the quality of cricket needs to continue to improve, sadly our best players are not interested in the longer format, so we must work with who/what we have. Fans are needed back in the stands, a world wide challenge in the longer formats (I would switch completely to night games)

In reply to hawk

Sorry about that...there are many intelligent bajan posters here.

....................

I am taking this step by step with you.

(i) Let's forget about the CPL. For all practical purposes it's run solely for profit and is irrelevant to the discussion which you joined.

(ii) Who funds the PCL and what is the broad strategic goal of the PCL?

In reply to Courtesy



Firstly......lets leave out condescending questions, if you have a point....just make it

Now why don't you tell me

corrected as per your edit

In reply to hawk



Dis done sah.

Nice to have engaged you in discussion.

Have a wonderful night.

In reply to Courtesy



that's fine have a wonderful night yourself

Jamaican i presume???

A professional league was essential and long overdue. We spent many years talking about the need for one and nothing was ever done. We could spend many years methodically trying to develop professional athletes before starting the league.
A good structure is lacking in the Caribbean, however given a chance to improve ones financial status, then I hope that desire for money will be an incentive for players to improve their skills. Money has been the great motivator for centuries. I am hoping that some young hungry players will do ala Shiv and go work in the nets for 6 hours a day. Shiv has shown that this approach works really well. I have seen inner city kids in usa without structure develop serious basketball kids by playing every day all day, dreaming of escaping poverty.This is my hope.

In reply to Baje

this is my hope too, thereby improving the standard of play and quality of the league, and by default...a better west indies side

In reply to Baje

This is the strategy to develop world class players in a professional system?

In reply to hawk

I agree that money would be a real factor. A professional would. It be able to focus on something when he has to think about 100 other things to meet his families need.

Now having players dedicated to the game is done. But this has to be complemented with coaches, facilities and exposure programs so that they develop the right way. It might take a few years for this professional league to bear benefits.

thjs is where I feel WICB has unnecessarily tampered with the senior team and spent too much energy. Instead if they had give them the free don while working with the next bunch we might have had good replacements

In reply to Pacy

exactly....but a start has to be made which is important, we now have that start and adjustments will have to be also need to be made going forward



plenty mistakes have been made, to the point where i am not sure it is "fixable", our experience players has lost interest in our domestic leagues, moreover the longer format, many have retired in frustration, what do we do...press on with who/what we have and develop our pro league

In reply to methodic

It is better than talking and doing nothing, like we have for the past 100 years. It may not be the most effective strategy, there are other developmental elements that are missing, but the motivation provided by money, has helped many third world residents, outperform better equipped and trained first world residents.

So what is your plan?

In reply to hawk... no, Don Quixote is from H&H land! And no matter how the argument goes, once you disagree with "them" you wrong and your a idiot etc etc. Talk about delusional.

In reply to natty_forever

you are right.... I have realise one gets criticize for disagreeing.

In reply to hawk

You are right. Many problem that are not fixable. Many potentially good players had to be pushed into the deep end because of the egos of some at the top. Young ones are being criticised when it is not completely their fault that they are not up to the mark.

In reply to methodic

The unintelligent here say half a loaf is better than no loaf instead of putting workable strategies in place to make an excellent whole loaf.

20 years of misery, yet we are comfortable and persist with a 'half a loaf' mentality. Is that how intelligent, progressive, proactive and forwarding thinking persons behave?

Isn't there a sense of urgency in rising to the top again. Doesn't it tell us that we have to do things radically different? Doesn't it tell us that we have to come up with a definitive road map that will yield success in short order?

Where is the 'do it right first time' attitude?

Does anyone see any major improvement to our level of cricket?

Then we throw our hands in the air and say we have lost interest exacerbated by a comatose system. Is that how we deal with a problem?

Achieving a strategic goal is not left at the whims of chance...leaders must make it happen with purposeful planning and execution.

Leave allyuh mental midgets alone.

Allyuh facters are agents of mediocrity.

We are doomed...when we continue to deal with straight jackets and simpletons.

I refuse to join this 'half a loaf' crowd.

.........................

Dats de progressive thinking dat de Courtesy endorses:

In reply to hawk

... Yaadies are insulted!

In reply to natty_forever

no insult to Jamaicans intended, i ask that because he had originally asked me

In reply to hawk... he jus have to feel you is a Yaadie, and he goes all Don Quixote up in here.

In reply to Courtesy

Yes, half a loaf is better than no bread.
Are you suggesting that we who acknowledge "half of a loaf is better", are somehow responsible for creating better strategies?

In reply to Baje

No...but we would be failing in our responsibilities if we do not demand from the WICB strategies that can result in a good two pence loaf. We will continue to receive half a loaf in perpetuity and that half a loaf will never be able to compete on the international stage.

And if the WICB is going to spend financial resources on the development of professionals we must demand a road map which will ensure results...not a monthly social security pay check with no appraisal system to evaluate the usefulness or appropriateness of your strategic objectives..

Btw, I support the WICB now so go easy on me.

In reply to Courtesy
Well I am very concerned about the way that the contracts are awarded. It seems to rely on individual territories to select the awardees. There is a lot of room for abuse (might be hard to take bread out of the mouth of your friend). The challenge will always be ensuring that the deserving recipients receive contracts.
I would prefer that the WICB selectorial board identify the 90 recipients, as opposed to each territory controlling the awards.

In reply to Baje

Continue...ah listening.

But don't criticize the WICB tho.

In reply to hawk

You mean you can just start a professional league just so, without plans for what comes next?

Mr Hawk, can you address the below quote from Courtesy.

In reply to Star

Guy...i cearly said make adjustments along the way, not make no plans, the league needs to be managed like any other entity, one would always want to improve and grow, so the CWI has to measure the success of the league and ensure it is get to the stage where it generates profit, it would not be there as yet, not even the CPL is profitable as yet but they are making the adjustments needed as they grow that league.

who do you think they should be appraising???