Message Board Archives
HEADLINE: A painful anniversary for West Indies cricket
CaribbeanCricket.com
Jan 7, 2015, 5:22:33 AM
2015 will bring a significant but painful anniversary for West Indies cricket. It will mark 20 years since the West Indies team was beaten by Australia at home and lost top position in Test cricket.
No real follower of West Indies cricket will ever forget the wicket keeper, Courtney Browne, dropping a simple catch off Australian Steve Waugh at Sabina Park.
Waugh was then on 42 and went on to score 200. That was the beginning of the end.
We could not remain world champions forever but no lover of West Indies cricket would, in his or her darkest nightmare, have dreamt that 20 years later we would be languishing miserably at the bottom of the pile with no sign of progress.
In that period, we have seen Australia rise and fall three times. We have seen England rise and fall and India the same. We have seen South Africa, who in 1995 had not long returned to Test cricket, produce a number of top-class teams. These teams are tired of whipping us. Our team has gone from bad to worse and is now close to terminally ill.
Full Story
mikesiva
Jan 7, 2015, 7:11:55 AM
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
The only people who are going to remember this anniversary are old-timers like you and me....
The youngsters have forgotten it, and either moved on to T20 cricket, or on to other sports.
Ridge
Jan 7, 2015, 7:25:46 AM
Blame Courtney Browne for the decline
Trinidave
Jan 7, 2015, 7:27:05 AM
TriniD remembers dat drop by Courtney Browne. He got ah lot of deserved heat fuh dat drop ketch, but in hindsight, no matter what happened, de downward spiral was always commin wid de rudderless leadership. Twenty years later, de WI ship still drifting.
Priapus
Jan 7, 2015, 7:31:19 AM
In reply to Ridge
Blame Courtney Browne for the decline
Shouldn't that be Drop Me Browne?..
Chrissy
Jan 7, 2015, 9:07:05 AM
POINT
Jan 7, 2015, 11:09:38 AM
I have continuously stated in this Forum How we got where we are ; and What needs to be done to get US out of this Morass .
Many agree with what I have stated , and some disagree with what I have stated .
The funny thing is that NONE of those who disagrees with what I have written , have offered up their solutions regarding Cricket in the Region .
The fact that they have not done that informs me that they are bereft of any solutions regarding the problems with Cricket in the Region .
jballer84
Jan 7, 2015, 11:16:18 AM
In reply to POINT
I must commend you as you make some outstanding and legitimate points, all of which I fully endorse. Now the question is, how do you spread the word and more importantly get people to buy into where the focus should be. I'm not sure how far reaching the messages on this forum are, but if you could have the eyes and ears of someone in an influential position or persons whom are able to disseminate info, that would be a good start.
I would love to know what our more popular media friends think about the great suggestions you have always posted here
tc1
Jan 7, 2015, 11:21:25 AM
In reply to jballer84
you are becoming POINT jr.
jballer84
Jan 7, 2015, 11:29:47 AM
In reply to tc1
you are becoming POINT jr
I most certainly wouldn't go that far, but the man makes a lot of sense and I give credit where credit is due. The issues and solutions referenced by POINT are essential to the growth of our cricket and more importantly to sustain that growth. Nothing he says is rocket science, just "good ole"common sense that a lot of folks are unfortunately lacking.
POINT
Jan 7, 2015, 12:25:52 PM
In reply to jballer84
Thanks for your Support . You raise a good question , however , I do not have the " Prestige " ; status ; Readership ; & Radio coverage , as people like Fazeer ; Mason ; Cozier ;
Becca et al .
Those who I have listed above are very well known in the Region .My perspective is that rather than state
what needs to be done , they prefer to tinker around the edges , rather than get to the heart of the Problems
regarding Cricket in the Region .
Perhaps they are afraid of offending those in the governance of Cricket in the Region . The Region is small comparatively speaking ; and those in
the governance of Cricket in the Region wield a lot of power .
It therefore seems as if people are afraid t tell the Emperors that they are stark naked . In my opinion , WE must also be severely critical of the ICC .
It has for many years refused
to reign in those in the governance of Cricket in the Region ; the ICC
has allowed the WICB to become a Rogue Cricket Board .
So the impression I get is that the
ICC is only interested in making money , It doesn't give a damn about
our Players not being as competitive
as they can be in International Matches . It would be nice if it bought 5 dozen copies of Dale Carnegie's book :
" HOW TO WIN FRIENDS &
INFLUENCE PEOPLE " .
Then gave all the persons in the governance of Cricket in the Region not only copies but also demanded that they read the books .
to be continued ............
POINT
Jan 7, 2015, 12:42:46 PM
In reply to jballer84
Continuation
Obviously the greatest obstacle to Cricket in the Region are those in the governance of Cricket in the Region .
Sadly they do not care much about whether our Team is relegated to tier 2 . They are solely focused on ensuring that they are in the governance of Cricket in the Region FOREVER .
They do not want ANY Changes to the current Structure of Cricket in the Region . They believe that making structural changes will dilute their Power , and that must never ever happen , even if structural changes
will improve Cricket in the Region .
They commissioned both the PATTERSON REPORT & the WILKIN REPORT ; and just as swiftly dismissed both Reports . I have concluded that they have the full support of the ICC regarding their Roguish behaviour .
spider
Jan 7, 2015, 1:54:22 PM
In reply to POINT
The funny thing is that NONE of those who disagrees with what I have written , have offered up their solutions regarding Cricket in the Region .
The fact that they have not done that informs me that they are bereft of any solutions regarding the problems with Cricket in the Region .
You are bereft of solutions as well. You just don't know it.
casiba
Jan 8, 2015, 6:01:13 AM
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
Courtney Browne is not be blamed for the Decline of West Indies Cricket.
SOLUTIONS: Disband the WICB. Appoint a select Caricom Committee to run WEST INDIES Cricket. If West Indies cricket is so important to the people of the Caribbean, it should be administered by a serious body. WICB is old and archaic and WILL NEVER administer cricket in a professional and satisfying manner. Too many bleeps and blunders !!
SirGarny
Jan 8, 2015, 7:23:42 AM
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
For instance, my coach friend suggested a system in which a man with oversight over an entire programme in the Caribbean would visit different territories and would have the authority to dictate what happens in each island; a system in which the focus is not on players doing drills, but one in which coaches are mandated to work on specific things and be accountable for what is done or not done. A great idea, if only persons would not be determined to protect their space, or lobby for their people.
Director of cricket Richard Pybus plan for transforming cricket in the West Indies includes having a coaching manager--a professional with regional oversight. Thus far, however, no such person is in place. But the need is urgent.
These are the same principles outlined in a proposal by Greg Chappell submitted to the WICB. It was flatly rejected. The emphasis was on coaches teaching the same techniques, the same way, and on a consistent basis.
John Dyson's remark during his brief tenure as coach, .."T
hese youngsters just don't have some of the basic skills."
Add to this recent comment by Clive Lloyd who stated that "too much T20 cricket is being played" and there are few aspirants for greatness in the 5 day game.
I guess wee will be #8 for a while and soon will struggle to compete with Bangladesh!!
POINT
Jan 8, 2015, 12:11:58 PM
In reply to spider
You are sadly mistaken ,in this Forum I have stated for over a decade that it was incumbent on those in the governance of Cricket in the Region to try forming a Regional Pro or Semi Pro League ;
when England imposed its ban on all Overseas Players .
At that juncture our Players & Team were the best in the World , I therefore do not think that doing that would have been difficult to do .
Sponsors love Winners , and our Team
ad Players at that juncture were
Winners . Please note I have always stated a Regional Pro or Semi Pro League .
My reasoning was that doing this would have helped our Players maintain their skills in all aspect of the game .
This was not done , and as a result,
when not playing in the Regional Tournaments or representing the Region our Players were basically Idle .
Obviously , over time their skills particularly Stamina - Mental & Physical ; the ability to concentrate for long periods & the ability to build an Innings suffered .
These are skills that are very important in the longer versions of the game . It is in the longer formats of the game where our Team is not as competitive as they can be , it is in these versions of the game that Our Players suffer lopsided defeats .
POINT
Jan 8, 2015, 12:18:29 PM
In reply to spider
I have always in this Forum stated that our Players need to play much more matches in the longer formats of the game .
I have also always stated that having a 1 week Camp is insufficient . I have
stated many times in this Forum that people in this Forum need to compare the number of matches in every format of the game , our Players opponents on Teams ranked above our Team have played and compare their stats to the stats of our Players . There is an Ocean of difference .
I cite these these to refute your comment about I not offering solutions . So your assertions are baseless .
spider
Jan 8, 2015, 12:27:58 PM
In reply to POINT
Then you must be overjoyed that this administration has instituted the new franchise system since it is something you have been advocating forever.
And how many times do you have to hear that England did not ban ALL overseas players?
Commie
Jan 8, 2015, 12:35:38 PM
In reply to spider
point gets into recursive loops at times.
spider
Jan 8, 2015, 1:52:18 PM
In reply to Commie
Ah don't know what recursive mean but I understand what you saying.
POINT
Jan 8, 2015, 2:32:03 PM
In reply to spider
Your knowledge of Cricket is exceedingly shallow . In the mid 1980's ENGLAND BANNED ALL OVERSEAS
PLAYERS FROM PLAYING IN ENGLAND THIS
IS AN UNDISPUTED FACT .
Sometime later , they allowed each County to hire 2 Overseas Players .
You are a very dishonest person , FYI
it is only last year 2014 that the WICB started a Regional League .
Now the mid 1980's would be around 1985 so in essence for about 39 freaking years the people in the WICB sat on their Asses and nothing .
It is the 39 freaking years I am writing about , that to this very day has affected the competitiveness of our Players especially in the longer versions of the game .
Let me state that when in 2003 I talked about this I was very careful in stating : A REGIONAL PRO OR SEMI PRO LEAGUE .
Unfortunately the Yahoos in this Forum chose only to focus on the fact that I said Pro , they completely ignored the fact that I have also stated Semi Pro in every occasion . I did that to counter persons saying that the Board has no money .
POINT
Jan 8, 2015, 2:32:51 PM
In reply to Commie
CONGRATULATIONS ; I see that you have joined the ranks of the Troglodytes .
spider
Jan 8, 2015, 2:44:36 PM
In reply to POINT
Don't know why I bother but please tell me when in the mid 1980s did Walsh not play for Gloucestershire. I actually think he didn't play in 1988 since WI toured England that year.
And are you happy with this new administration for finally starting what you have been advocating for a long time?
POINT
Jan 8, 2015, 3:12:59 PM
In reply to spider
Why would I be happy with those in the governance of Cricket in the Region when it took them 39 freaking years to
do what they should have done roughly 39 years ago ???????
spider
Jan 8, 2015, 3:16:48 PM
In reply to POINT
You don't have to be happy about everything but are you not happy that they were at least able to do that, even though it is long overdue? And what about Walsh and Gloucestershire?
POINT
Jan 8, 2015, 3:29:29 PM
In reply to spider
As I have stated , some years after the imposition of the ban ; Each County in England were allowed to select 2 Overseas Players to play for them .
Perhaps that is how Walsh played for
Gloucestershire . Ask anyone if England at one time banned all Overseas Players from playing in England .
Prior to the imposition of the ban most of our Players played Cricket in England when not representing the Region in International Matches .
spider
Jan 8, 2015, 3:34:09 PM
In reply to POINT
At no time did they ban all overseas players. And I don't have to ask anyone because I was around in the 80s.
casiba
Jan 8, 2015, 3:53:45 PM
In reply to mikesiva
Somebody needs to respond to my comments
POINT
Jan 8, 2015, 4:05:40 PM
In reply to spider
I really don't care when you were around . Ask any of your Friends or even persons in this Forum if at one point ALL OVERSEAS PLAYERS WERE BANNED FROM PLAYING CRICKET IN ENGLAND .
As I have already stated , currently each County can only employ two Overseas Players to play for it .
Commie
Jan 8, 2015, 4:11:47 PM
In reply to POINT
When was this ban
spider
Jan 8, 2015, 4:19:04 PM
In reply to POINT
I'm saying there was no ban of all overseas players. Since you say there was then provide the dates. And what happens now is not relevant to what you asserted.
It is ok to admit you made an error. Nothing wrong with that.