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CMC – FAST-bowling star, Jofra Archer says his snub by West Indies selectors for the 2014 Under-19 World Cup fueled his desire to represent England, and has once again shot down any suggestion of representing the Caribbean side.
The 22-year-old Barbadian featured in three matches for the Young Windies on Bangladesh Under-19’s tour of the Caribbean in 2013, but failed to make the final cut for the World Cup staged in the United Arab Emirates the following year.“It wasn’t really anything to do with injuries,” Archer told the Times about his being overlooked.
“I wasn’t selected, so I had to think about what to do next. Once I knew it was an option, it was an easy decision to move to England.”He added: “I was angry with the West Indies, so that helped me with my decision to come and try to play for England.”

And unfortunately this is nothing new, in fact it is the norm. Young Archer was shamelessly pushed away and the selectors and other administrators who were in charge then must be publicly shamed and banned for life from all cricket leadership activities.

Now, lets see if our esteemed journalists in the region will do their job and track down those rabid selectors and have them answer to the court of public opinion.

In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com

you don't need to explain anything the same way you are not entitled to anything

go get your England cap

how did he perform at u19...esp in those 3 matches

article missed it or i missed it?

In reply to doosra

He was credible and could have made the team- he had such potential, other picks were no better than him.

This is really about inept selection- the passage of time has proved how inept the selectors were.

Just go back and look at the team and then compare where the majority of those players are today versus Archer- the facts will shine and we'll remove bias opinions.

In reply to Emir

In reply to hawk

i hope this comment don't come to bite his hum when it comes to england selection

because ova deh dey doh need an excuse to leave you out

In reply to hawk

Good comment, Archer in his previous days was injury prone and there were doubts about him being able to withstand the challenge of cricket fitness, however the County Club in England took a chance on him and he was able to rectify so far his fitness issues. I guess that was why the WI Selectors were taking a wait and see approach towards him.

In reply to doosra

Imagine these guys feel entitled at U19! I'm glad that he used that as motivation to become the player he is, but he is not owed anything!

If one gets a scholarship from a company, does the company owes that person a job?

I am trying to connect the dots re Windies players where "at will" seems to count for nothing!

Tha entitlement ppl my guess!

In reply to hawk

This is simple..West Indies didn’t want him after close up examination..they didn’t see how good he was...they ignored him and didn’t help his injury....chris jordan( not a selector) recommended him to Sussex who nurtured and groomed him.

It is nothing about him being entitled or West Indies investmentand other nonsense posted above.

Through Sussex he has become a professional and got overseas contracts.

I spoke to a Barbados selector in 2016 and said he would be a great loss...the selector said we have much better talent in West Indies. That may be true but our administrators sure know how to mismanage talent and squander it...always it’s the players fault ( pollard,Bravo,Bravo,Narine,Simmons Russell,Ramdin,Chanderpaul and others)...but this pattern suggests poor local leadership rather than lack of talent.

I am reminded of " The Invisible Man "
and James Anderson who both opposed each other in an U.19 TEST SERIES in England .

Kenroy Peters was adjudged to be the
Best Bowler in the Series ; HE however
was discarded , James Anderson on the
other had was nurtured , and is currently the best Pace Bowler in England .

I cite this to buttress the point
that in the Region , unfortunately getting selected aint about talent .

Kenroy Peters plays for a Cricket Club in England , and was also hired to Coach Youngsters in England . He
is currently employed playing for a Cricket Club in Australia .

This then begs the following Question:

WHAT IS IT THAT CLUBS OVERSEAS SEE IN

KENROY PETERS , THAT HAS ESCAPED THE

ATTENTION OF SELECTORS IN THE REGION

????

Sadly I have concluded that Archer
has made the Right Choice . The current Standard of Cricket in the
Region is not only PISS POOR , it is
below the level of what is required to be Fully Competitive in the International Cricket Arena .

In reply to POINT

That’s right....talent is one thing....developing it is something else

Archer will soon be 23...he has been nurtured by Sussex since 20...because he was away from home he was actually living with Jon Lewis the fast bowling coach and receiving a living wage.

That kind of support ain’t coming in Barbados ....

In reply to doublecentury

man stop talking shoite. how did Sussex nurture and groom him? the man is on record crediting his step dad for encouraging, advising and taking him to games. unnuh does really spout some crap. yes Sussex took a chance on him on suggestion by Jordan, which was made easy by him having a british passport or the ability to get one but nurture and groom?

In reply to sudden

father taking you to games is all that is needed or the main thing to becoming a decent cricketer?

Personally I think he is very naive to think that England will STILL want him at 27 over others with international exposure.

He needs to think about himself and not petty grudges of being overlooked (he is not the first nor the last to be overlooked early in their career). Why can't he be playing at test and ODI level for WI for example, taking in the T20 leagues and STILL turning out for Sussex? A cricketers career is very short in my opinion one needs to maximise when you are in your prime,

In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com

Sorry I think you snubbing WI now cause of what you feel they do you during U-19 that's a poor ass excuse. Sounds like a weak mentality to have.
No one owe you nothing like how you say you aint' owe WI nothing
Wishing you all thew best though cause as a cricketer and west indian want to see u do the best, but next time you get drop don't hold a grudge.

In reply to doosra

i see you forgot the encouraging and advising bit. your standards are falling mate. i should call Jala

In reply to sudden

Oh I bow to your superior knowledge...jofras father lived in Liverpool...I spoke to him in Cardiff when he had travelled to watch his son play...Jofra has been playing club cricket in Sussex and with Sussex over the last three years ..

I suppose as you can write “ shoite” you must be a bajan...but pray tell me what I wrote that is wrong ....ask vasbert how he wishes Dominic ( born in uk) had a British passport.

Jofra has made very public how much Sussex have groomed nurtured and helped him...so it’s no secret.

Ask Corey the difference between Barbados support and Sussex...or ask Dwayne smith.....

In reply to doublecentury

so he was not nurtured and groomed in Bim or that is only extended to a 20 year old going to Sussex?

i know Frank Archer. i went to school with Frank Archer. Jofra referred to his step dad and the coach at his secondary school(Foundation) for his development.

sussex nutured and groomed him? wuh loss muh belly

In reply to doublecentury

Link Text

In reply to Chally1

In reply to sudden

how many u19s have the wi system nurtured to decent intl cricketers in the last 20 years

that might help you

In reply to Star

we need the scorecards

man where is cricketarchive free

Let's say ALL our players had options of playing somewhere else, how many of them do you think would opt to play for the WI?

If you can answer that question honestly, you'll understand Archer's decision.

In reply to doosra

no it doesnt. it may help you tho

In reply to Larr Pullo

archer's decision is the right one for him

First why did he believe he would have a better chance in England?

Second ...was he right?

Third ...how did he go from being an under 19 reject to a full time professional star making over $ 1 million a year in three years?

Simples really.

It all stems from the fact that there is indufficient sustainable professional cricket and development in West Indies .we have talent and ar compatible at under 19 but not at a full time professional level.

So it is correct that he developed up to under 19 in Barbados but if he had remained he would not be the player he is now.

In reply to sudden

it cannot help you because of the convenient shoite yuh peddling

same crap wunna seh bout Jordan

the fact is they developed their trade in the English system

no amount of insular tripe can change that fact

In reply to sudden

the decision is the right one...many supported it...even if it doesn't matter

but trying to justify it with shoite is what people talking about here

In reply to doosra

In reply to doosra

finishing touches yes. development as a continuing process yes. nurture and groom no bloody way.


i went to Eng at 19 and there is no way on God's green earth could i honestly say that i was nurtured and groomed in the UK. how? my grandparents, teachers at Cawmere and positive interactions in Bim nurtured and groomed me.

In reply to Larr Pullo

how many u19s have our system developed to good fc cricketers and intls in the last many years

that is my argument...they went to England and they developed their trade ... they played plenty 2nd XIs and lower level cricket there

let us not be disingenuous here

In reply to sudden

sudden

i am talking about cricket, on the field stuff...no doubt their formative years are important but we have seen truck loads of better talented cricketers in the wi go no where post u19 because the system is failing them

yes all of us, you , me, larr , every grandmother and their cat have said this over and over

now we are saying the same system failing our system is the one that gave us this archer and jordan

we need to make up our minds

In reply to doosra

that is quite different from saying that Eng or sussex developed and nurtured Archer at 20 years when he spent his formative years in Bim playing cricket. the same goes for Jordan.

so which system is responsible for Chanderpaul, lara, Gayle etc. and now Hope, KB, Goosey etc.?

In reply to doosra

Development is an ongoing process. You think they'll take unschooled and unprepared cricketers into the England club system just so? What England is providing for the Jordan's and Archer is a finishing school to get their game up to what is required to be international players, and that is what is lacking in the WI.

In reply to doosra

there are many cricketers in Oz, India, Eng that do not develop to their full potential for whatever reason. it is human nature. our failing is exacerbated becos of our limited population

In reply to sudden

So Sussex can only nurture and develop Archer and Jordan?

What happened to all the other UK u19s that pass through?

How many of them representing England?

Or are they only good with already good bajan players?

In reply to FuzzyWuzzy

exactly Fuzz. having lived in both countries i can tell you that they are no better than us. they may have us on how we deal with issues. we tend to be less sensitive in the WI. we need to understand our young people want positive interactions and be told the reasons for doing things

In reply to sudden

Archer should make his decision and forget the silly justifications.

In reply to FuzzyWuzzy

BINGO

In reply to FuzzyWuzzy

that is where he lost the plot

Boy this is silly...

The question is not how good English under 19s are....

It’s why West Indies are competitive at under 19 and bad as professionals at first class level and tests.

I could make the same argument about Sunil Narine and then the pride of Barbados wouldn’t be hurt....Narine was developed and nurtured by queens park cricket club. But abandoned by ttcb and wicb....his later devopment was by an Indian club.

In reply to doublecentury

try wid dem

i gaan

the challenge in this part of the world was the lack of a forum where cricketers can be developed effectively, point cited the James Anderson/Kenroy Peters model, i will cite the Dinesh Ramdin/Alistair Cook Model, in both instances the West indian player was ahead of the englishman at the U19 level, however that is where we lose it while the englishman goes on to a county contract and rub noses with other England professionals playing 20 first class games in one season, if they lose form they drop down to a second XI toruney, our boys go back to their amateur league and rub shoulders with weekend cricketers, they use to play at the most 5 first class matches a year against has been at the test level while our "pros" globe trot, should they have a bad run of scores they are relegated to being idle or back to their amateur league.

some initiatives are now in place to fix this, with the advent of the PCL, but this is baby league right now, i would love to see 20 First class game a year for our guys, i would love to see a a second XI league running alongside the PCL, maybe these along with the players working hard at their game would keep our players on par with the others into their early 20s

In reply to doosra

It's a sign of maturity when you can admit that you're wrong...

In reply to doublecentury

what do you understand by the term- develop, nurture and groom?

In reply to hawk

Ramdin and Cook???? What about Smith and Cook?

In reply to Larr Pullo

you have not countered my argument yet

England are more likely to produce top class intl and fc cricketers than wi because their system is better

it's not by chance that they have one of the best odi outfits at the moment..just beat Australia in australi by what 5 or something
that's the format archer is ahead on
that is what i am saying

if a wrong on that a wrong

Here’s a thought...at under 19 World Cup the England manager (Mark Robinson) said he thought Jason holder was the best he had ever seen.

Both Carlos braithwaite and holder looked like they had it all.

Now both Chris Jordan and Jofra Archer are much quicker and superb fielders and better batsmen too.

I believe the thesis that development for professionals in the county system is superior to the Caribbean is indisputable.

Better ask why and what to do than assert it’s just Shoite.

In reply to Larr Pullo

haha. were you nutured and groomed in the US after Burnham gave you that scholarship?

In reply to Larr Pullo

i cited Ramdin/Cook because they played U19 together

In reply to doublecentury

stop please. Link Text

do you honestly know what or whom you are talking about. we have said that development is a process so yes he could be developing under sussex, the same goes for finishing touches but no way was he nurtured or groomed by sussex, according to the normal usage of those words.

In reply to hawk

By these arguments every Englishman from the Randim era went on to be outstanding international players

On the other hand how do we account for kraigg Jason dowrich Chase etc reaching the top?

In reply to FuzzyWuzzy

in all honesty by international standard Kraigg, Jason, Chase, Dowrich are all Average players, Kriagg is ahead of them all but with a 37 average, he won't mentioned among the likes of Williamson, Kholi, Smith and Root, by my arguments, i am not saying we wont produce good players, i am just saying other countries go onto professional status...our players did not and that professional set up aids the development at a faster rate, i am sure Kraigg will have a productive career but will be become a run machine like the others???? ...I would love it but i am not so sure

In reply to hawk

Point taken. But don't players have some role to play in their development?

Btw as players are Archer and Jordan leaps and bounds ahead or their Windies peers?

In reply to FuzzyWuzzy

The Windies has higher standards but the uninitiated wouldn't even recognize that if it hit them over!

McSween, Jerome Jones, Mindley and Ray Jordan...those were the fast bowling picks.

In reply to FuzzyWuzzy

Players have a huge role in their development, i believe they need to work very hard at their game moreso than the other countries given our WICB/CWI poor management of our cricket over the years, they took way too long to establish a professional league, this should be in place since the early 90s, because talent alone won't do it, you cannot develop test players with 5 first class matches a year, then the mental side of the game has to be developed the ability to handle pressure, sledging etc only comes from playing quality cricket, not that weekend crap we call an elite division.
Jordan and Archer aren't any better than what we have in the West Indies right now, when i look at players like springer, C holder, Yadram, A Joseph, Archer developed due to exposure to the England professional set up and support systems, had he stayed in Bim he would reach this stage in about 3 years, Jordan same thing, he did well enough early on to catch the English selectors eyes, but where is he now, highly unlikely he is in England plans for a future test pick, his best option is ply his trade in T20 leagues do well and he will get a play for England in T20 only, i expect Archer's career to follow similar lines

In reply to hawk

In reply to sudden

So nurtured and developed must be under 21? Semantics....When he went to Sussex he was a discard and had a serious back injury that needed careful management and rehabilitation.under the close supervision of Jon Lewis ( bowling coach with whom he actually lives) Archer improved dramatically in both 2016 and 2017. Hence bg bash and IPL contracts at just 22.

But I can say shai hope was nurtured and developed in Sussex ( at Bedes school) right ?

Jofra? Excuses, Excuses, Excuses.

Very plain and very simple, you prefer to offer your services to the Mother Country.

I wish you well. I hope you have a very long and fruitful career with England, moreso than any other black player who has ever represented England in cricket.

One can only hope that after your successful career with England, no one will have to ask this question - What happened to the black cricketer?

In reply to doublecentury

Your second to last paragraph speaks volumes . In this Forum I have continuously stated two very important
points , pardon the pun :

FIRST , PLAYERS ON MOST INTERNATIONAL

TEAMS PLAY MORE CRICKET THAN OUR

PLAYERS .


SECONDLY BECAUSE THEY PLAY MORE

CRICKET THAN OUR PLAYERS , THE

STANDARD OF CRICKET IN THOSE

COUNTRIES IS HIGHER THAN THE

STANDARD IN THE REGION .


OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE THEY PLAY MORE

CRICKET THAN OUR PLAYERS ; THEIR

CONCENTRATION , MENTAL & PHYSICAL

STAMINA IS SUPERIOR TO OUR PLAYERS .

Unfortunately the Big Idiots in the
governance of Cricket in the Region
refuse to understand this Freaking
Fact .

In reply to POINT

In reply to hawk

I AM ONLY EXERCISING MY FREEDOM OF

SPEECH , NOW IF THAT OFFENDS YOU &

OTHERS TOUGH LUCK .

When Grown People behave like Idiots
THEY must be called out . Go and ask the Big Idiots , why they have
REFUSED to change their Structure since the Formation of the WICBC/CWI?

Also ask them what is the purpose of
Commissioning Several Reports and then discarding these Reports ?

Ask them , why they perpetually have
disagreements with their Employees before the Players Tour to Represent
the Region ??

Ask them why did they cancel the last
Tour to India which was in progress ?? I will always insist that persons who behave like that are Idiots .

BTW what I have stated here are Freaking Facts , not figments of my
Imagination . Look don't let me get started . The President made a comment about a Player and was ignorant of what level Contract that
Player had . I can go on , but hopefully you get my point .

In reply to sudden

This youngster should just try to make the best of his choice now instead of calling people out.

Me think he setting himself up fuh nuff egg pon his face .... hope it is big enough!!! I would love to be wrong...

In reply to POINT

as usual nothing wrong with your points or facts, if you read my post on this thread we said the same thing, however disrespecting people will never win them to your side of the argument and your facts/points will go unnoticed

in other words to effect change you must influence people, this cannot be done by disrespecting them, this is an area lacking in the WICB/CWI, you would be wise not to do likewise

I HOPE YOU GET MY POINT

In reply to hawk

are you part of the cabal

In reply to tc1



once you disagree on this MB you are label part of the Cabal

A lot can happen in three years Archer. Hope you know what you doing

In reply to hawk

WHAT YOU PERCEIVE TO BE YOUR POINT

IS EXCEEDINGLY BLUNT , DUE TO THE

MASSIVE MALADMINISTRATION OF CRICKET

IN THE REGION .

Did it occur to You that by cancelling the Tour to India the Big Idiots made
the BCCI incur massive Debts ???

Did it ever occur to You that Darren Bravo was not accorded DUE PROCESS ;
In essence , a Hearing to present his
case in the matter ?????

Do YOU realize that the WICBC/CWI has
a Disciplinary Committee , and that
was Bypassed , in their eagerness to
punish Darren Bravo ???

Frankly calling them Big Idiots is
rather a mild term . In my opinion
The President had a Duty ,Obligation
& Responsibility to ascertain precisely what Level Contract Darren Bravo had .

The stark fact that HE did not know
aptly demonstrated that He thought
that was a trifling matter , however
it was not a trifling matter to Bravo.

THE MIMIC MEN HAVE HABITUALLY TREATED

PLAYERS WITH SCANT RESPECT , WHILE

DEMANDING THAT PLAYERS RESPECT THEM .


MY TAKE IS THAT EVERYONE MUST BE

TREATED WITH RESPECT ; IT AINT A

ONE WAY STREET .

When those in the governance of Cricket show respect , I will show
them respect . It is that Freaking
Simple .

If CB had stuck around and played for England, things in WI cricket would have been different. Wouldn't it...?

In reply to POINT

Have it your way my friend

TO GET RESPECT ONE MUST SHOW RESPECT

It is that freaking Simple , the problem however , is that the Mimic
Men prefer to behave like those who
Founded the Organization .

The crux of the problem is that the
WICBC/CWI bears an abiding animosity
towards its Players ; this is why in
my opinion , this youngster would be
better off playing for England .

There is also concrete proof that the
Standard of Cricket in England is
higher than the Standard in the Region .

Interesting how some on this thread have in the recent past been quick to label other players mercenary and disloyal, yet now vigorously defending archer’s choice as him making the best decision for him.

This msb is funny indeed. One might even say sammyesque.

In reply to imusic

I am surprise that you don't see the difference

In reply to hawk

Don't be surprised! He has a stealbeam in his eye

In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com

The main point here, is that the WI Selectors or Board over the years have failed to select the best talented players in the region and groom these players for the international arena. There are many factors for this as we all know, including selection policies, territory insularity and the structure of our tournaments (to name a few). Once we become honest with ourselves and fix the many things that are broken in CWI, then more talented young players will leave our region if they get the opportunity to play elsewhere. That is what Archer did and this trend will definitely continue until we fix our broken system.