Message Board Archives

Donald Trump and his attempt to dismantle the  US democracy.

There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true. –   Soren Kierkegaard

US Constitution I.3.6
"The Senate shall have the sole Power to try all Impeachments. When sitting for that Purpose, they shall be on Oath or Affirmation."

Presumably, if a Senator goes off on a screed that is not true, it could be perjury.  The Republicans can wage a public obfuscation of one or two causes for impeachment, even if expressed in two or more articles.But they would have a harder time voting many more times to assert full abdication of the right to congressional oversight and full acceptance of a despotic president.There is no shortage of claims of violation of the public trust that can be advanced against Donald Trump. Despite Republican objections, "overwhelming proof" is not needed for an Article, as impeachment is not a criminal proceeding and the Constitution makes no such requirement.

Donnie refused to read the Constitution even though he took an oath to support it. When reporters asked him about the Emoluments Clause a few weeks ago, he didn't know what they were talking about and accused them of making it up. The Republicans declared false swearing as an impeachable offense in their attack on Clinton.  

The Articles of Impeachment need to be determined and written in such a manner that boxes the complicit Republicans into the world they have created for themselves. With each vote for acquittal, McConnell and his ilk need to formally acknowledge they are OK with election interference by foreign entities, obstruction of justice, aiding and abetting an enemy of the US, nepotism, treason, bribery, emoluments and any other "crimes and misdemeanors" this president and his administration has committed. If nothing else, it will serve as great material for political ads in 2020.

The Constitution is not indifferent to who is president, or the balance of good and evil achieved. Its central purpose -- and the purpose of impeachment -- is to maintain and preserve the US system of government and free elections. Anyone who subverts that must be removed. This system has outlasted any and all Presidents, and that's how it should and must be.

Trump and his resulting administration has been by far the worst mistake Americans has made in the past 30 years, and there have been some remarkable missteps in those three decades. As much as Americans would like impeachment to set a strong example that a President and a party are not above the law, Americans are terrified that the disinformation and scare tactics used to get them into this mess will be used in martyrdom to further divide the country. These are not people who will go lightly into the night, primarily because they are willing to burn everything to the ground rather than compromise much less concede defeat. Justice at what price? 

Think , Trump's election could be much more consequential.Americans don't know the cost of leaving the Paris Accord, or the Iran nuclear agreement, or the things with N Korea and Russia will lead to. It’s clear that Russia interfered in the 2016 election and as Mueller said they are currently interfering now. Trump, Moscow Mitch and Barr are doing nothing about Russian interference past, present and future.  The fate of humanity itself may be affected but US democracy itself may be at stake. US Citizens don't know because no one knows the future but some agree about various wars and other mistakes except with an asterisk - let's watch out for this. 

All these years Americans had no idea that the bombing of Cambodia, and its coverup, was debated as an article of impeachment.
The level of devastation to Cambodia would be hard for younger Americans who did not live through this era to comprehend. The 1984 movie , “The Killing Fields”, based on the recollections of the Cambodian journalist Dith Pran, is worth seeing. Americans  dont know that US bombs over Cambodia led to the overthrow of Sihanouk and the emergence of the Pol Pot/Khmer Rouge horrors and genocide in Cambodia (or even that Sihanouk's government had been a "relatively stable" one).  
Had this been an actual article of impeachment in Nixon’s case, and hearings, Americans could imagine the George W Bush administration may have taken some pause before falsifying intel to justify an attack on Iran. But of course, we will never really know.

Make no mistake: in the end these articles of impeachment will likely matter more to history than to our immediate future. Republicans in the Senate are conspiring with the White House as Americans read the paper this morning, to manipulate the process into a farce that exonerates their chosen dictator while obstructing facts.Perhaps the US should seriously consider the message to future generations while it can. Besides the obvious fact that running to the Courts to have them decide whether a Congressional subpoena is valid, is a frivolous delay tactic which shouldn't be rewarded by letting the White House succeed in running out the clock.

In addition to the primary schedule to consider, it should be remembered that any SCOTUS decisions (on producing tax records, etc.) which aren't rendered until the very end of this SCOTUS term in June, will leave only July and possibly part of August, before GOP'ers will be chanting "no investigations or prosecutions that could influence the November vote" honoring the DOJ policy of a 90-day lull in such activities before an election.

If it is intentional on the part of Donald to run against 'impeachment', and he (along with his party) wants to win by running out the clock - he cannot be allowed to make an end run around the rule of law in such a manner, and especially not by filing frivolous lawsuit fluff pretending a subpoena from a coequal Branch is something to be questioned.  
Yep, but it's not necessary to hold up the referral to the Senate for trial, waiting on those subpoenas to work through the Courts; the Intelligence Committee can still issue subpoenas and take testimony after they make the Senate referral, and the House managers at the Senate trial will be able to call whomever they want as witnesses - with the Chief Justice presiding, a lot of the frivolous, theatrical, faux-lawyering won't be successful.

Too bad the Republicans are in such a rigid arm-in-arm lockstep, allowing nothing to sway their ideology or penetrate their version of reality. America has the perfect storm of a world-class narcissist and an entire political party determined to ignore all the wreckage Dear Leader causes on a daily basis. It's up to the voters a year from now whether they see the danger ahead or if they don't care. It's clear the GOP doesn't.  
As America watched Matt Gaetz, Jim Jordan, John Ratcliffe, et al. verbally strutting and puffing yesterday, Many Americans grieved for John Conyers, Elijah Cummings and other dearly departed congressional representatives who understood the epic responsibility and solemnity of their office and behaved accordingly. For the current crop of Republican representatives, these hearings are strictly a golden ticket of media exposure; nothing more.

Trump has cloaked himself in patriotism, yet he has blatantly demonstrated how unpatriotic and Un-American he is by using his office for self-aggrandizement and in his own self-interest. As George Washington said, “Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism.” Trump is the imposter in the midst  "snowing the public with blizzards of misinformation and outright lies..."

Above all,some Americans grieve for their country. 

Just an opinion. 

Could not have said it better myself.

If all of the opposition from the Repuglicans were honest and credible, it would merit some sort of attention. However the hypocrisy is astounding.

These are some of the same guys who impeached a president for having sex in the White House.
That did not add up to bribery, high crimes or misdemeanors, but they impeached anyway.

Thank goodness BHO was a model President, otherwise he would be impeached just by virtue of his middle name.

In reply to embsallie

However the hypocrisy is astounding.A true comment.

If Obama has done 10 % of what Donnie has done they would have hanged him for treason.

POTUS is trying to get the clock to run out, I hope
Congress sees this ploy.

I heard the Christians leadership say that POTUS committed the divorces, sexual acts, etc before he became President, it doesn't count. Amazing....

As usual well said

In reply to sgtdjones

In reply to pelon

Trump is enabled by the super wealthy who wants an ignorant populace that swallows whatever they are fed.. Great country, great economy, great military. RA RA RA

but the electorate cannot get basic health care and a good living and they don't care once they get the Ra Ra Ra medicine..which they gleefully swallow...

Its real sad.. Give some people the leeway and slavery and the decimation of the native population will be written out of text books and purged from history.

This is not about Trump but about the lives of the next generations..

In reply to sgtdjones

A good read.

All what is said is true.

However, the issue is not that people do not underatand that they are being sold a bill of goods.

It is that they asses said goods and deem it not relevant to what is important to them.

In the absense of a standardized measurement of pure gold there are many who would accept a lower quality at exorbitant prices.