Latham was out.....and holder just went back and bowled....the entire cordon wanted the review because they heard the edge which snicko confirmed....totally unacceptable. The slip cordon has a better vantage point than you holder
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Holder not reviewing caught behind
2020-12-03 12:38:49
2020-12-03 13:14:23
In reply to Jumpstart
Maybe the first review for LBW they burned had something to do with that???
2020-12-03 13:16:43
In reply to StumpCam
Yup thats it.
2020-12-03 13:18:01
In reply to StumpCam
Excuses....there was a clear noise, latham went on to make 86.he was in his 30s
2020-12-03 13:30:35
In reply to Jumpstart
I’m saying they used up a REVIEW when they shouldn’t have! It’s not an excuse but poor game management! The first review was clearly not out!
2020-12-03 13:30:43
In reply to Jumpstart
.the entire cordon wanted the review because they heard the edge which snicko confirmed....totally unacceptable.
Holder lost faith in his team's collective judgement when Gabriel insisted on that lbw review at the start of the match, against Holder's judgement. If Holder had agreed to that second review and it was unsuccessful, he would have never heard the end of it. The cappo is only human.
2020-12-03 13:56:19
In reply to Norm
You seem to know what is in people’s mind.... 
2020-12-03 13:56:42
[b]In reply to Jumpstart
the entire cordon wanted the review
A man sees and hears what he wants to hear/see. There were THREE fielders in the slips plus Dowrich. Bravo( 1st slip) was voiceferous Dowrich (wkp) lukewarm and Campbell(3rd slip) 1/4 hearted for a millisecond Blackwood (2nd slip) never moved a muscle.
Dowrich takes the blame here as the nick was loud enough, Bravo wanted to press the issue to Holder but Dowrich did nothing to help the cause. This is on Dowrich only not Holder who (1) was farthest from the action (2) was never pressed for a review.
2020-12-03 15:13:48
What about the umpire who gave it not out? Why isn't the umpire being blamed? Afterall, there was an appeal and the umpire turned it down.
2020-12-03 15:19:56
In reply to b4u8me2
oh gosh....is nz with local umpires, you know they're not going to be fair(which visiting team has NOT complained about the umpiring standards in NZ?)....hence the reason to utilize the review facility
2020-12-03 15:40:27
Maybe dey need a set of coded messages from de dressing room as England have been doing
2020-12-03 18:16:00
Only Bravo seemed particularly keen. The others were not that interested. Holder apparently heard nothing and just turned to walk back to his mark. We heard it clearly, I think, because of the stump mike.
2020-12-03 18:19:58
In reply to spider
Holder apparently heard nothing
Yet still his slip cordon was appealing. Dowrich is not usually animated so i fail to see your point. That has been one of my constant problems with holder. As a captain he seems to be out of the game way too much. perfect example, english tour of 2017, WI with a genuine chance of beating england, taking the series and at Lords, no less. Heavily overcast conditions and Holder decides to bat. And we lose because we obviously don't make much in the first innings. Getting latham in the 30s would have put NZ under pressure and the wicket was gifted to us. The spell alzarri bowled at the other end was fantastic and if we had gotten a new batsman in, there is no way he was going to survive it
2020-12-03 18:39:01
In reply to Jumpstart
Only Bravo seemed convinced. The others hardly appealed. Dowrich looked to have started and then stifled his appeal. If they were convinced they'd all have gone up animatedly. This kind of thing has happened before. I remember Ridley Jacobs getting what we on tV heard as a clear edge and nobody appealed. The only person who seemed to think there was a clear edge was Bravo. The captain wasn't going to review based on that, especially after a wasted one.
2020-12-03 18:57:29
In reply to spider
Whatever yes, some of allyuh west indians dont have an iota of standards. Whatever this team does is secondary once your islands get a forward and they kneel down for BLM before being beaten to a pulp by white teams
2020-12-03 19:04:13
In reply to Jumpstart
Oh please fuck off
2020-12-03 19:06:40
In reply to spider
truth hurts homie
2020-12-04 06:42:00
Did not see the incident but i remember thinking yesterday that Dowrich is not positive enough for a keeper. Keepers needs to be loud chirpy cheerleaders of the team. Even if he wasnt sure he should be initially appealing aggressively if only to influence the umpire. Did he?
2020-12-04 11:42:28
In reply to b4u8me2
What about the umpire who gave it not out? Why isn't the umpire being blamed? Afterall, there was an appeal and the umpire turned it down.
Exactly.
2020-12-04 11:46:35
In reply to JoeGrine
Dowrich takes the blame here as the nick was loud enough, Bravo wanted to press the issue to Holder but Dowrich did nothing to help the cause. This is on Dowrich only not Holder who (1) was farthest from the action (2) was never pressed for a review.
Yes, in this particular case, once the umpire refused, it was on Dowrich to read this appeal an he failed, this is routine for wicket-keepers and I agree with the commies of their criticism of him.
Now Dowrich dropped a catch in the 3rd over of GABRIEL, now others may say the same batter was out next ball, but its a big difference, because that same ball could have been to a new batter.
Dowrich hasn't had a good match and I hope he now will come good with his batting.
2020-12-04 13:31:37
Guess they have to plug into the stumps mic because only Bravo showed any real interest in really appealing. Others were not sure of anything. Stump mic is just below where the contact was made, maybe the reason the commies made it out so easily. Tough first day but that would have changed complex of the innings.
2020-12-04 13:57:02
1. Umpire should have sent him
2. Batsman should have walked.
Why do we always ignore the fundamental issues in favour of the peripheral ones?
2020-12-04 14:11:59
In reply to culpepperboy
you know why? because the udrs system was meant to solve those things. I have seen two tours of NZ live involving the west indies in the pre-udrs era and i have seen nz cricketers cheat with the assistance of nz umpires. Every team complains about nz umpires, not just the west indies. Remember how long the cricketing world was afflicted by Billy Bowden's incompetence? An NZ batsman is not going to walk. As i told someone earlier, the udrs system is there to snuff out mistakes and cheaters. In the last 30-35 years, only 3 batsmen have been consistent walkers: Viv(who i did not see live but i have seen tapes of his innings) Lara and Adam gilchrist. Batsmen usually don't walk even though they should and hence the udrs facility is there for that. Holder did not even consult with the slip cordon. He just turned back and went to his mark. Unacceptable
2020-12-04 14:54:08
In reply to Norm
Holder lost faith in his team's collective judgement when Gabriel insisted on that lbw review at the start of the match,
Your logic does not make sense. Isn't it collective judgement that should rule the day when it comes to such situations?
In this instance you had three slips and a wicket-keeper appealing. Should you just turn and walk back to your bowling mark without consulting with them because the first review did not go your way?
That is not how it is supposed to be. Yes you are captain but you should collaborate when four of your closest fielders to the bat appeal in unison for a caught behind. You should not arbitrarily decide that you don't want their input.
2020-12-04 15:01:29
In reply to Star
exactly....as i told spider. Alzarri was bowling a fantastic spell at the other end which a new batsman would have been unlikely to survive. It was a pivotal moment in the game
2020-12-04 15:12:46
Bravo was the most vocal ins appeal, the wicketkeeper and the other slip fielders were not as vocal, and it is obvious Jason did not see to heard anything
As I've said numerous times, the technology is there, we that were watching heard the sound, the CWI management group in the pavilion heard it also, why was it not relaid to the team.
Last night I saw New Zealand bowling coach on the side talking to various bowlers, during the match, not once did the West Indies bowling coach, left his seat, in the NZ first inning.
The Technology is there use it.
2020-12-04 15:23:50
In reply to openning
Now yuh blaming de management.........i dunno if to laugh or cry. Hoss, you remember the last person who asked management for "help" to make an on field decision? A certain Steve Smith in india? Smith had to apologize because that is cheating. The review system is for the captain to utilize and he has the fielders close in for consultation. In this case, holder failed to utilize the help or the system and the guy was out
2020-12-04 15:47:52
In reply to Jumpstart
The technology is there use it.
Are you not tired of seeing players running unto the field with towels of bottle after every over, why you think these players come out?
Was the New Zealand bowling coach cheating yesterday, being on the side line, talking to his bowlers, was that cheating?
Dude, this was argued on this MB before, everyone know my position on the captain, coach and team management roles.
2020-12-04 15:53:08
In reply to openning
Hoss if a player had run unto the field during a potential review that would have aroused more than enough suspicion....and as i said before, that is cheating even if it isn't legislted
2020-12-04 16:01:09
In reply to Jumpstart
Why would a player come unto the field during a review?
There are many ways to skin a cat.
2020-12-04 16:04:59
In reply to openning
You can't review a decision after 10 seconds has elapsed. I dont know what you expected, for them to have a complex system of walkie talkies so that the could communicate with the on field players....a la australia with ball tampering in 2018. Your suggestion is that the WI would have been the only team after australia to consult off field sources for review decisions....wow. What standards
2020-12-04 16:23:16
In reply to Jumpstart
Ball tampering is official looking at what a players is doing with the ball, over time during a match, this is done by the officials, Coaches in the pavilion have access to monitors, they see and hear things.
None of the players convinced Jason, Bravo did not get help by the wicketkeeper or the other close folders.
Roach was vocal in convincing him, we heard that loud and clear.
He was on his knees pleading.
We all are Monday morning quarterbacks, cricket has been moving away from some of it old policies, the one I would like to see, follow other team sport, is the role of the captain.
I think it is archaic
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