HEADLINE: West Indies cricket will continue to experience talent drain

link CaribbeanCricket.com Joined: Mar 5, 2003
Posts: 9995
9/6/21, 10:36:27 AM 

West Indies cricket will continue to lose its young talented players to countries like England because there are no systems put in place for their development beyond the Under-19 level, says former Barbados and England cricketer Roland Butcher.

The first black player to represent England in the 19080s, Butcher’s comments followed this week’s announcement that 17-year-old Barbadian Jacob Bethell will co-captain the England Under-19 cricket team against West Indies in the upcoming Royal London International series starting tomorrow September 4 at Beckenham.

Butcher said Caribbean people must face the reality that there are many more young cricketers who may take such a path because they have that bonus of holding a British passport.

The likes of Che Simmons at Warwickshire and Nico Reifer at Surrey who all played for Barbados at the regional Under-15 and 17 levels could also join Bethell if they so desire to play for England.

“In terms of losing talent to England that will happen because people like Jacob and others have got options. He has an English passport as well so it doesn’t mean that he has to commit to the West Indies.

Read more at Barbados Today


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link sudden Joined: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 45557
9/6/21, 10:37:15 AM 
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com

As usual Butch is correct

link VoopsandOut Joined: Jun 14, 2017
Posts: 753
9/6/21, 10:40:35 AM 
West Indians generally emigrate. We have been losing talent for generations. This is nothing new. Additionally, didnt someone say that the boy's entire family emigrated to England? it is not a case that he went to England just to play cricket because West Indies were not developing him. One can equally say that India and West Africa lost talent to the West Indies.

link Jumpstart Joined: Nov 29, 2017
Posts: 4374
9/6/21, 11:41:44 AM 
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com

is only bajans leaving.....they have not produced anything of note in recent history. save jason

link tc1 Joined: Jun 11, 2004
Posts: 14867
9/6/21, 1:15:37 PM 
In reply to Jumpstart
The tits cannot leave since they rarely produce any in recent, past or present save Lara.

link Logic Joined: Jun 18, 2005
Posts: 3791
9/6/21, 7:25:51 PM 
In reply to Jumpstart

is only bajans leaving


That's cause many bajans returned home after making some money in UK. Their children or grandchildred have UK passports. When trinis and others migrate to UK they tend not to come back home. Who can blame them

I would risk a bet that the pacer Barnwell playing for Englad U19 has Guyanese origin family. But we are not talking about him cause he grew up in England

link powen001 Joined: Nov 25, 2006
Posts: 56926
9/6/21, 9:28:08 PM 
avatar image
In reply to Logic

cool

link Norm Joined: Nov 27, 2002
Posts: 34908
9/6/21, 11:34:11 PM 
Take Kent County Cricket, for example, chosen randomly. Look at their talent pathways here on their website. Can you find anything similar on any website associated with any Caribbean cricket administration?

The closest I am aware of are the programs run by the Rose Hall Town Cricket Club, in Berbice, which developed Clinton Pestano, the Crandons, etc, and most of the female players in the Guyana team for years. What did they get in return? The illegal GCB under Sanasie, supported by many big name clubs in Georgetown, and company refused to give them their annual "stipend" from CWI and did a lot to undermine and destroy the Rose Hall Town Cricket Club.

In Georgetown, the Demerara Cricket Club also has a youth development program. Malteenoes was built on the concept of community service and development, but these clubs have all suffered under the extremely petty politics of the likes of Sanasie, who in turn was strongly supported by Dave.

So, why do we whine about our "talent drain", when we ourselves are the main cause of it?

Take the situation across the Caribbean today. Does CWI care, for example, about the ability of members of the Windwards board to develop or even sustain their cricket? Does CWI ever attempt to garner support for those need it, or is that a function only of how the local cricket administrators vote?

Even if CWI is lame, do local governments attempt to organize support for local cricket? Or is political gain the primary factor in these matters too?

So, why do why do we whine about "talent drain"? Is this so that we could blame others for our own screw-ups?

There are some efforts such as those mentioned above, but it will take a lot of effort to collect and make them accessible online.

Anyway, we are a people who have mastered the art of whining, as a precursor to blaming others for our own follies.

Meanwhile, others continue to show why they continue to make steady progress, while our continue to steadily slip into more and more misery.

link Scar Joined: Nov 13, 2002
Posts: 13025
9/6/21, 11:44:40 PM 
Nothing wrong with trying to play for England if you grow up there or your whole family moved there. Same as any other country and sport. There are many pros and recent athletes doing this in soccer, track, basketball, baseball and cricket over the years. In cricket however, not many either make the first team, starting 11 or keep their place. The history of WI cricketers having long careers for England is not good. They seem to get that one or 2 series then become an after thought or put aside at the first mistake they make.
We keep blaming CWI for those 'transfers' but on the other hand what does it say about English talent if their system is filling up with 'foreign' players from WI,RSA, Ireland etc. Also who is to say those guys will outshine the youngsters in the caribbean in any format.
CWI simply need selectors to choose players on merit, consistency and the occasional chance on a 'diamond in the rough'

link Norm Joined: Nov 27, 2002
Posts: 34908
9/6/21, 11:51:52 PM 
The career development pathway at Lancashire.

link Jumpstart Joined: Nov 29, 2017
Posts: 4374
9/7/21, 6:03:00 AM 
In reply to tc1

People in the IPL would beg to differ.

In reply to Logic


That's cause many bajans returned home after making some money in UK. Their children or grandchildred have UK passports. When trinis and others migrate to UK they tend not to come back home. Who can blame them


Homie what are you talking about? Most of the professionals in TTO are still in TTO. Which is why of all the immingrant communties, Trinidadians tend to be among the smallest in concentration. In fact, Bajan and Jamaican professionals come to TTO to get employment.....still.

The reasons they're leaving are that the english don't allow more than one outsider on their county sides. Before the few players who played in the IPL, that was what cricketers used to suppliment their income. The WICB does not and quite frankly cannot pay the the salaries the players deserve. Thirdly, the West indies has been uncompetitive for the most part for the last decade or so, with a few notable exceptions. Its facts and they, under Hillaire and Dave Cameron were quite contented to pick 2nd string teams. And Ricky Skerrit is not on picking 2nd string teams. His selectors pick the best team available.

link Maispwi Joined: Feb 3, 2003
Posts: 15604
9/7/21, 10:01:51 AM 
Ah suppose Robin Singh is a Guyanese. But are cricketers different from any other profession? Doctors, nurses, lawyers, engineers, teachers, you name it leave these shores to "better" themselves overseas.

When WI were winning did we complain about, DeFreitas, Lewis, Lynch, Butcher, Headley, Malcolm, Singh, Slack et al playing for other countries?

link Logic Joined: Jun 18, 2005
Posts: 3791
9/7/21, 10:08:43 AM 
In reply to Maispwi

Correct. Please also point out to Falsestart that only one of those names is Bajan origin

link natty_forever Joined: Apr 27, 2003
Posts: 56695
9/7/21, 10:09:00 AM 
In reply to Maispwi

Exactly!

link Logic Joined: Jun 18, 2005
Posts: 3791
9/7/21, 10:23:26 AM 
In reply to Jumpstart

Homie what are you talking about?

Nobody is taking stock of how many Trinis left TnT. I know I left nuff of them in England and if you think they got Bajans in TnT you should do a head count of the number of trinis here. But the difference once again is that the Bajans will mek the money and come home. Once the trinis get here is hard to get them out dont mind they be criticising Barbados ever other day...they dont want to leave.

The subject for discussion was this comment as it related to cricketers:
is only bajans leaving


And on that score, sir, your point about not many trinis going to England only enforces my comment about descendants of Barbadian returning nationals having British passports which open a gateway for them starting professional careers in England. If the Barbadians did not return home we would not be talking about their children or grandchildren leaving the Caribbean. as we do about the likes of Archer and Bethell. Same way we are not talking about Mr. Barnwell, Mr. Malcolm, Mr. DeFreitas, Mr. Lynch, ....etc

link Overthrow Joined: Mar 24, 2021
Posts: 448
9/7/21, 11:14:28 AM 
In reply to Maispwi

Would like to interject Robin Singh migrated as a result of marriage.

link Jumpstart Joined: Nov 29, 2017
Posts: 4374
9/7/21, 8:31:01 PM 
In reply to Logic

Nobody is taking stock of how many Trinis left TnT. I know I left nuff of them in England and if you think they got Bajans in TnT you should do a head count of the number of trinis here


Cant be that much. I know a few including a loud mouth economist who disrespects public officials when they don't agree with her or take her advice about crypto-currency. And i do stand by what i say. The only reason some players(overwhelmingly bajan) are leaving is because the economic conditions in the region are tough, even though they were tough in the 80s when the entire region was under IMF Structural adjustment programs. The biggest reason though is the demise and terminal decline if WI cricket.

Secondly, TT citizens could not get UK passports because we've been a republic since 1976. The Queen is no longer our head of state.

Some people, like the parents of Chris Lewis or Gladsyone Small, would have come to England as children abd decided to play for England, modtly because WI cricket was still very strong and their chances of playing for the WI would have been very small indeed

link sudden Joined: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 45557
9/7/21, 8:56:59 PM 
In reply to Jumpstart

Small left Cawmere around 14, 15.

He was a batsman at school.

His parents lived in the UK

And like me and a lot of the lads he lived in Bim with his grandparents and aunts until his parents sent for him


I left after 6th form

link Jumpstart Joined: Nov 29, 2017
Posts: 4374
9/7/21, 10:18:00 PM 
In reply to sudden

Yes i read that. Think he is a Manchester University alumnus too. Was actually a very tidy bowler.

link tc1 Joined: Jun 11, 2004
Posts: 14867
9/8/21, 11:21:36 AM 
In reply to sudden
]
[i]I left after 6th form
[[/i]

over the years, it seems like the laws changed, my dad had an UK passport, my sister emigrated to uk at ten. several years after that they did not allow me to enter, to do 6th form work, the reason was that I would be taking space in school from an English lad.

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