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bat on fellas. Poorman time. no Hope to slow up progress so we looking for at least 300

King hope Tage.. this team needs players like these..atleast for odis

In reply to sudden

he slow up already and out. damage done.

In reply to sudden

I find the system of Not Out really silly.

Hope 128 NO + 16 Out = 144 in 1 match.

Look it is not the same match.

In reply to nick2020

N.O. is shoite for determining averages

anyhow regarding Hope- I Hope Doosie will have some Courtesy when discussing this WI innings

when hope don't score big this team has no hope a bunch of t20 specialists in 50 overs cricket makes no sence

In reply to sudden

What?
Striking at 75 will get you 250...that's a fact

What do you want to explain

If you can't understand that then too bad
Get your insular head out of or backside man

In reply to doosra

Hope actually put pressure on he own self.

And we saw it earlier in the innings...at 4 runs from 10 balls he played an out of character shot for 4.

In reply to sudden
I blame these outs on SR.
Hitting a 6 every over, is 100% sr
These guys can hit sixes, they just can't bat 15 overs.

In reply to doosra

what about the other batsmen?

In reply to sudden

dude, you are stuck like a broken clock

that is a separate issue and does not make the Hope issue false

did we not say that a million times yesterday? what difference does it make if he scores a 100 and we are still falling below par? his own innings the other day shows what urgency can get you - an above par score

Hope going at 75 gets us no where (we are already over 75 for this innings)...he himself knows that....
today for example he had 15 dot balls out of 26 and was trying to move things on...
it tells me that is part of the 'everything' they are trying....

i feel like i am wasting my time now...i do not subscribe to bat out and get 100s that get us nowhere...if you want to win you have to do what it will take to win....striking at 75 does not

In reply to doosra

Thanks Doosra. You have me typing less.

I'll paraphrase Dukes...some persons will not change their minds even in the face of overwhelming evidence. It is clear that some persons do not understand maximum utilization of resources.

In reply to doosra

what are you on about?

i am not the one who mentioned Hope's SR, banna

i have had my say about that many moons ago.

my post was more in relation to Hope getting out early so Poorman et al could better pace their innings

In reply to sudden

Dude, you are being as binary as nick....

Hope DOES NOT need to get out early for others to have a higher SR...

for example....if he converted 4 (conservative) of those 15 dot balls today to singles...he would be 20 of 25 and less pressure on himself to take big risks early...
that also means that the other dot balls are available for the others to try....

man to me the matter is simple and i know Shai and management are working on it lol

In reply to doosra

have had that argument before.

and i did not make it now

all i posted was Hope being out early giving the other batsmen space to do their thing

you can take it where ever you like but i am not biting

In reply to sudden

i am not advocating for Hope to get out early...of that i am extremely sure

i want him to bat long but just keep that SR higher and dot balls lower

he did it perfectly the other day...we don't need perfect everyday...we need intent everyday

In reply to sudden

Let's conclude: Shai Hope is generally slow and eats up dot balls when compared to top order international batsmen.

The other batters with the exception of King are certainly not up to international standards.

So, we have a team which more than often than oy will fall short at international level.

Howz dat?

In reply to doosra

i had to do all that for you to get to this point

banna, that was hard work

i can live with that argument

now what about the other batmen?

what is happening with Poorman?

In reply to doosra

In reply to Courtesy

well i wont go that far reference Hope but thanks for attempting to answer

In reply to sudden



It's all about maximizing resources. The science of the game and the general lack of skills have left us far behind.

We are a long way away from Bazzball.

In reply to sudden

so this is what i will say

I am sure Shai knows that a good leader cannot demand more of others if he himself is not giving more

if he's striking below par, his demands of others will hold no weight

i expect them all do better as we move forward into an above par environment

In reply to doosra

Nope, not all hope is gone - 261 is ok for an ODI.

In reply to doosra

In reply to nick2020

In reply to sudden

All you had to do is mention the name Hope and like honey de bees swarming

In reply to Courtesy

Nope.

In reply to nick2020

not me and dat Pelee case, boosie
no, no, no, not me

In reply to nick2020

In reply to doosra
Yesterday I looked at India and Australia four first batsman, not only their SR are 85 or higher, their average is also above 37.

We just don't have bats who can rote the strike, we either hit or block, Shai need a few batsman that can stick around, the longer he bats, his SR will get to the norm.

Gayle has a SR 87 and an average of 37, did he had batsman to assist him.
You need a batting team to get the overall SR above 100, that should be the focus, not Shai below norm SR.

In reply to openning

to whom much is given much is expected, seems to be the argument

i dont think they/we expect much from the others

In reply to sudden
The game must have change because no such argument was discussed when Lara with a SR of 79 and Shive SR of 70.
Lara average 40.48 SR 79.51
Shiv Average 41.60 SR 70.74
Were we winning then?
The team concept is taken out of the discussion or maybe Shai slow batting is the reason for us losing.

In reply to nick2020

An opener made 70 from 70 with his runs coming at the top of the order in the powerplay and men torking 'bout 'Hope' The 'hope' should be that coaches and players can teach him and others to bat 120 balls minimum when set.

In reply to openning
Did you really post about Lara and Shiv's sr Dude????
Everyone on here either know or has discussed the change in the
game and what impacts this new era. Lara and Shiv played most of their game
in the 90's early 2000's. Gayle who played for 15yrs roughly played half
or more of his ODI career in the 'slower' era and has an 87sr. If you
look at his sr from 2011 to end of career it is perhaps close to 30 runs
higher than Hopes. C'mon man!

In reply to Brerzerk

King SR 79.67
Hope SR 75.32

King Ave 26.65
Hope ave 50.02
When you bring theory and also dealing with humans, our makeup is different, that's why in a team, you should not focus on one player SR.

I believe it is incumbent to clarify quantitative and qualitative analyses yet again

qualitative analysis is concerned with the reason why things happen, the causes and effects. it deals with the behaviour of humans in particular settings, their emotions, actions and reactions

whilst numbers are raw and remote, human emotions, actions and reactions are how we express ourselves. hence why raw numbers cannot alone describe and inform this discussion and why one has to examine the relative batting skills of our players and how they react and behave in certain circumstances which I posit is more important than a strict examination of the numbers game

the qualitative examines the wherefores whilst the quantitative looks at mathematical coding and raw stats. put another way the qualitative voices and interprets the quantitative.

In reply to openning
A bag of irrelevance to say the least
if a+b =c then d+e = c also just because you say so with nothing else presented


Interpretation-One can choose to say anything to justify what they wish

Dukes is right- One will not change their thinking in the face of evidence if they 'believe' something


Chrissy was even more correct with 'The Theory' she posted some time ago.

And you do make a comparison between a 22 match player and a 100 match player who instead of regressing (as Hope did in tests) and ultimately dropped
is actually improving while finding his way. SMH

In reply to Brerzerk

In reply to openning
King made 70 today. The discussion id wi really interested in WI cricket should be how to develop him, Hope and a few others to face 100+ balls at that sr consistently.
Do you realize that Lara's Saes n Shiv's sr would be close to 100 in todat's ODI? Talking about Hope n King do you have any idea of Amla's sr and how many sixes he hit?

In reply to Brerzerk
When dealing with teams I never looked at one player, or as a manager one employee.
King's SR is almost the same at Shai, with Shai having an average , twice his.
Why I am not hearing anything about King's SR
The first 4-5 batsman in the Whitehall formats are the ones responsible to get the SR up in the two PP available to them, I surely don't need anyone to tell me that.
Again let e say, we human beings are not all the same, Shai trying to move his inning along, maybe out of his comfort zone, where as Rodman Powell would enjoy hitting the ball to all parts of the ground.
King face 70 balls, 230 were available to the 10 other batsman, how many of them had a sr of 87?
We saw what he is capable of doing in the first match, and it took him sometime to get his sr up, asking him to score quick, may cause him his wicket,
He maybe a player that take longer to get going, than some of the others on the team.

Some fellas only went to TABC.

Dat facker blame the lone disCourtesy among an entire population for Windwards not producing decent cricketers but Shai cannot be criticized for a SR of 75 when the international standard for front line batsmen is 85.

Shai if he is ambitous, should be aiming for the international standard.

Stiff necked fool.

In reply to Brerzerk The transitive property of equality surely ain't that!