The Independent Voice of West Indies Cricket
Ramnaresh Sarwan has assumed the poisoned chalice that is the captaincy of the West Indies team.
The 26-year-old right-hander was confirmed as the 29th captain of the regional team as a WICB meeting today in Barbados. He has been placed on probation with strict performance targets. -teaser-
Sarwan, who takes over from the retired Brian Lara, will lead the West Indies on tour to England next month.* More to come...
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com CRICKET-WICB-LEAD WICB confirms Sarwan as new Windies captain
What I want to know is when dat truth teller Ken Gordon is going to resign?????
Congrats to Ronnie!
I truly hope he gets ALL the support from the different stakeholders. He's going to need it.
Well Done Ronnie the right man got the job good luck for the taks ahead I know you will do a great job :)
Good Luck Ronnie!!!!!!! 8)
Where's Carib to come and pledge unreserved buy in?
In reply to Larr Pullo Yuh think is only dat old higue dat allyuh kill gainst ronnie??
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Gwaaaan Ronnie... tek ovaaaaaaa
I will pray for you my son...
In reply to googly1961
Pray?
He better start going to church!!!
In reply to Dukes
One thing I eh understand.
Why put him on probation at the very beginning of his tenure?
Kinda suggests that he have some sort of "history" or something. Odd.
Congratulations and good luck!
In reply to Larr Pullo
Should we start the martyrdom proceedings from now?!!
In reply to imusic
They are trying to prevent him from misusing the captaincy like Lara did.
In reply to Dukes
ah was wondering what yuh talkin bout Ole Higue..ah jus read the story :lol:...that shit aint funny...damn..in dis day and age
In reply to Larr Pullo
In what way?
Firing the Physio?
Cancerin WI cricket?
Picking too many Jamaicans?
Picking too many Trinis?
Racking up too many losses?
Undermine and stab every captain he ever play under?
Bettin on cricket?
Drinkin too much?
Havin too much woman?
Tellin Roger Harper to haul he ass?
In reply to imusic I suppose that is the "compromise position".
Clearly it is idiotic.In 1999 when Uncle Pat placed Lara,Lloyd and Marshall on probation it was equally ridiculous.
Let us hope that Sarwan inspires a similar turn around like Lara did and hopefully a much more prolonged turnaround because in the very next series we lost all 7 International matches.
In reply to imusic
Who did all dat bro?!! :wink: :wink:
In reply to googly1961
I jes tryin to cover some a de tings Lara get accuse of... 
In reply to imusic Tellin Roger Harper to haul he ass?
As far as Larr is concerned that crime is punishable by death!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
That early pronouncement of probation don't sound too good ... "poisoned chalice" indeed!!
Why put a stigma to the man's reign ... and him don't even gone 1/2 day YET ...
the WICB is a wicked set a peeps ... dem blighting da fella from jump ...
Well... I guess it means Sarwan will be have to be on his Ps and Qs with every movee he makes.
In reply to np
When you get a new job aren't you under 3 months probation?
In reply to Larr Pullo
This is a promotion. Not a new job.
In reply to imusic
Tell him deh music ...
And LARR .. I eh tek no job where I'm under no facting probation ...
All my jobs start with a long-term time frame to do the do .... OOOOKKKKK!! 8) 8)
I wonder what kinda of team sars will pick for england!! ! hmmmmm
In reply to Larr Pullo
Apart from the one-time that Lara was under probation .. this is only thesecond occasion I am hearing that in WI cricket ..
Did Jimmy A have a probation pronouncement, did Hoops ?? Did Walsh .... I cannot recall ANY!!!
Why Ronnie, why? Enjoy the honeymoon. The vultures are waiting.
The BBC on the money as usual.
Good luck Sarwan! Be careful of the fair weathered friends!
In reply to Chrissy
Allyuh notice how Cricinfo teef CC.Com word for word widout any acknowledgement.
We should sue dem backside!!!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
In reply to tops Did you include people like Alvin Kallicharran,Deryck Murray,Gordon Geenidge and Desmond Haynes.
In reply to Chrissy y u doan res'yuh pessimistic ol'self...........jeezzzzzzzzzzzzzz :evil:
Good luck Sarwan..ah hope some of the venom on this board will cease for a while and allow you and your team to pick up de pieces....careful now..
In reply to Dukes
Only Alvin Kallicharran...If the afore mentioned are included in the 29, then Sarwan skippered the WI before now, aint?
In reply to Dukes Gordon will not resign. He was simply posturing. Like I said before, if he truly believed that the leadership should take the fall for the failures he would have resigned before Lara did.
He is a media savvy person and he knows the impact of his resignation which was not a resignation.
In reply to tops
Deryck Murray captained a test in Australia - think Lloyd was injured. Greenidge captained 1 test and Haynes 4.
In reply to dcbreds
In reply to dcbreds
Thanks. btw, is Lara three or one. :?
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
Good luck Ronnie. All true WI fans are cheering you on. Hope you prove us doubters wrong.
In reply to anandgb
The good thing is that I did not want him to accept the captaincy. Same way I did not support Lara's last call or Shiv's. 8)
Give it to Gayle. It will be OK if his batting declines because of the captaincy. We will not miss him. :lol:
In reply to dcbreds Now now, be nice to Gayle. I noticed they did not appoint a VC for an overseas tour.
Or will Sarwan have to select someone?
In reply to anandgb
Just trying tuh give dem yardies ammunition. They need all de help dey could get. :lol:
Good luck, everybody wishing the man good luck, if good luck was what it took, Lara would still be captain and with a winning team. What Sarwan need is not good luck but a good obeah man, that’s why I am recommending a yardie as his VC, a yardie who can connect him to a good obeah person, that is the only hope he has for success. :lol: :lol: :lol:
In reply to anandgb
Annan you in heaven now, along wid you Muddies frenz Jala, Dukes, Larr Pullo,
Enjoy. Ah hope wunnuh no vex when people say homeboy support
Congrats Sarwan all the best. Now that you are the man I expect you to pull up your own socks first and then demand, insist, and demand again all XI players do same.
Too bad you are stuck with this dinosaur called the WICB who on one hand place you in charge and on the other placed a handcuff. The day we see the demise of this gang cannot come to soon.
I am not looking for any magical turn around but I do expect to see improvements, passion and a little guts (not big stomach) on the field.
Wesley
In reply to hewesleyb
How has he been handcuffed?
In reply to Dukes
Here’s my list of captains so far:
Adams, Chanderpaul, Greenidge, Goddard, Haynds, Hooper, Kanhai, Kallicharran, Lara, Lloyd, Murray, Richards, Richardson, Sarwan, Sobers, Walsh, Worrell. That’s 17, who are the next 12?
In reply to tops Headley(??),Alexander(?)
In reply to tops
Here is the entire list
In reply to tops You thinking the West Indies team is only post Goddard?
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy You do have a big big big chip on your shoulder.
In reply to anandgb
Be nice. Just give a helping hand.
In reply to dcbreds
In reply to anandgb
Nah, he just old like dirt! :lol:
In reply to dcbreds :lol: :lol: Now who is na being nice eh? :lol:
Tops will come back with a verse to attack us, watch :lol:
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
Congratulations Sarwan!
Hopefully people will not make the same mistake they made with Lara -- impatience, absurd expectations and lack of adequate support.
And hopefully Sarwan will put under rest all the speculation about his lack of discipline etc. and will also grow not only in his captaincy role but also as a batsman in the coming years.
In reply to anandgb
No, but did you know Robert Nunes? Remember, be honest...
What about Edward Hoad?
In reply to dcbreds
Thanks dcbreds. Now that I see the list, I recall a few like:
Nelson Betancourt, didn't know he was captain...
In reply to subaltern
Good talk deh
In reply to tops
Yeah, and men like Nunes.
In reply to dcbreds
was Nunes not the first Cappo?
In reply to dcbreds
Based on this chart - if you take out Zim and Bangla - the worst WI captains are statistically based on win %age in descending order
1) Chanderpaul - 1 for 14
2) Hooper - 3 for 20
3) Adams - 2 for 13
4) Lara - 8 for 43
Chanderpaul was 1-10-3, meaning he lost 10 out of 14 or over 70%.
Lara with basically the same team was 0-3-4, meaning he lost 3 out of 7 or 42%.
So much for the "Is Lara fault" argument.
No one with sense can say Lara was the worse WI captain ever.
In reply to tops Yes. I must agree that I did not know them all. But I was aware that we had captains befor Worrell :lol: :lol:
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy
Yeah he was. 1928.
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy
In reply to sabina how many did dat same bunch draw........drawn matches are important too
In reply to dcbreds
Wouldn't have ever guess Robert Nunes was WI captain. I also forgot Jacobs had captain 2 tests.
I am still waiting for Anandgb to tell me about Edward Hoad... :lol:
In reply to tops
I also knew about the Trini "boys" in the 40's - 50's. They had runs not because of nationality or batsmanship or leadership skills. Work out the rest.
In reply to tops They still have the RK Nunez trophy for outstanding performances on tour!!!!
In reply to anandgb
Alright, where was Maurius Fernandes from?
In reply to dcbreds Gomez and Stollmeyer were intelligent,cultured young men with keen cricketing brains.Stephen Camacho and Robin Bynoe also had keen cricketing brains :wink: :wink: :wink:
In reply to jala
Rass. You a baby who everything must be spoon fed to? Do the rest of the math yourself.
In reply to tops Guyana obviously!!!!!Famous family in GT
In reply to Dukes
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Yeah, dat was a good one Dukes. We seeing eye to eye on something for once.
In reply to Dukes
I'm getting my WI history lesson tonight. :D
In reply to tops
Never to OLD to learn! :lol: :lol: :lol:
Probation on a new job is when you are an unknown quantity to the organization. They need time to evaluate you as a person and a performer. They cant go on your certificates and recommendation letters. They dont put you on probation after a promotion - they only promote you if you qualify, deserve it and have the experience necessary.
Otherwise proboation is when you have basically committed a breach of law/rules deserving dismissal or incarceration but your value or potential warrants a second chance. You are now warned that you will be under constant scrutiny and only one slip up will cost you your current privilages.
Is this somethimg that describes Sarwan? Do you think any other country will shackle their captain like this? After all arent all captains held up to certain performance standards known to them? Should Sarwan take the job under those restrictions or are there any on field restrictions at all? If so WICB wants to control the game while it is being played on the field by tying the captains hands!! How can you perform adequately when the hot breath is felt on your neck!!
Just something to ponder!! On the other hand the word probation may be that of the source alone and not the actual words of the WICB>
In reply to Dukes
I know he was from Guyana, but Anandgb didn't know... :D :lol:
In reply to dcbreds
In reply to Scar
I agree that 'probation' sends the message that they are not totally sold on him. I agree with TrueBaj who said that they could have announced that he is appointed for the tour. After that they could have reassessed and reappoint or not as the case may be.
However, I dont neccessarily see it as a handcuff...but an incentive to Sarwan to prove them wrong.
In reply to tops Make sure you absorb everything :lol:
In reply to tops I doubt that a Guyanese would hear the name Fernandes and not recognize it immediately.
Who do you think Nicolette Fernandes(squash player and former "friend" of Sarwan) grandfather is??
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
Looking from a distance and judging by what I have read from "time to time" about Sarwan,I dont think he fits that position,that position as someone already describes is the "poison chalice",Sarwan for his own good should not accept it not yet anyway.The other options are Gayle and Ganga,since Ganga may not get the respect from the players then Gayle should be the captain.
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy
In reply to karela Thanks for your well thought out contribution. We (Ken Gordon) will take it under consideration. :lol:
In reply to imusic So you would rather infer that it is an infringement from Sarwan that caused this decision?
I am simply wondering if you had been absent from this board for the last year?
To put things in perspective you should be reminded that teh selectors and cricket committee both reccommended Sarwan a year ago and again this year.
There was 1 man who objected 1 year ago and then tried the "offer resignation" tantrum this year.
Now I wonder how that factored into this conundrum?
I agree, It must be because Sarwan visisted the mound.
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy It is the WICB mentality of "one try drop them" that makes it a handcuff as they do all our young batsmen by not giving them a full run.chance to blossom. Kinda like "Showtime at the Apollo" to some degree. If they get beat 3-0 will he be yanked? Can he take calculated chances as in any sport and not be fired as a result?
But we should awaut the 'rules' under which he can captain before we criticize.
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy
In reply to imusic
you feel something in the mortar beside de pestle ?.. 8)
In reply to Scar
But some people conquer the Apollo...ent?
I can see that he can be dropped for a 3-0. He is only as good as his team.
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy If they are prepared to drop him after his first drubbing in England this Summer I do hope they understand he will be finished, done, for good as a player.
Wesley
In reply to hewesleyb sorry..typo. it should be cant drop
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy Taking the captaincy away would have the same negative effect.
Wesley
In reply to DAVE400
Some people well defensive when de question raise bro.
Normally dat tell yuh sumting.
In reply to hewesleyb
Dont misunderstand me I am not saying he should be dropped merely for a 3-0. I am saying the opposite.
However, if the criteria is about conduct, fitness, etc and he does not meet them, then regarless of the score they can revoke the appointment
In reply to anandgb
When we loose this series 4 nil what sort of re-action do you envisage?Dont you think that the knives would out and the person taking all the blame would be Sarwan.This WestIndies team is going to be loosing for a long time to come so if Ronnie wants to go into the history books as the worst WestIndian captain ever, then thats his choice.The vultures are circling;ALREADY.
In reply to imusic and Dave400
Help me out. Was Sars Lara's VC before Chanders?
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy As I said in my inital post I thought you were being pro·voc·a·tive.
Wesley
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy Help me out. Was Sars Lara's VC before Chanders?
WHAT??????
No wonder you post what you post.
PHEW
In reply to karela
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy
I do believe he was.
If I remember correctly, Sars was appointed WI Vice Captain after WC 2003 in South Africa. WICB then recommended that he captain Guyana so that he could gain valuable experience and Guyana did not comply with that request.
In reply to dcbreds
Century Sars.
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
DOUBLESMAN:Hello one and all. Ronnie is a good choice. Congrats to him. I hope he has thick skin.
good luck Ronnie
In reply to imusic
It was big and bold bro...Lara was pt on probation after de SA debacle..Pat Rousseau eh mince words..dat ah could understand ..but arwan now start..dem put de man on probation..something not right .. :roll:
In reply to Dukes
In reply to DAVE400
And all I askin is wha cause dat? De probation ting doh make sense.
Eedah he do someting dem eh like &/or he doh meet some criteria dem have. And if he eh meet some kinda criteria, what has happened between when dem did name he vice cappo and now?
Nobody really seem to want to answer.
In reply to imusic
rally around ronnie.
best of luck bro.
In reply to FuzzyWuzzy
I believe they went to Shiv because of the C&W Sponsorship issue?
However, that has since been resolved. Long time too. Dat cyah be de explanation fuh dis probation.
Unless u sayin is bad mind WICB bad mind. Dem is a inept organisation, but I cyah believe even dem so low.
In reply to imusic
You may be unto something there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
In reply to imusic
Last probation was the President who seemed to call for it ..a wonder if KG had a hand in dis one..
Ah find it strange nobody got a leak or inside info..
This is not about Sarwan being put on probation! It is about the position itself. The captaincy is a position that has to lead from on top and set the examples on and off the field! These guys have had a history of very poor discipline and work ethic. I do think this is the right move to help create a more strict work environment instead of some government look alike workers that shows up for work on the 1st of the month waiting for their checks at the end of the month (you get my point). However, the board need to establish this mentality at all levels of the organization.
In reply to azadtnt Do you think that if Ganga was named captain he would have been put on probation???
Ronnie made captain? lol, man this is gonna be factin great! I cant wait.
In reply to imusic Hence why many are saying that the WICB is "badninded" The cappo will have to take only WICB sponsors regardless of how much he will get or else? Will they blame Sarwan for every player mishap on the field? Graham Smith and Ponting are absolute kings on the field will Sarwan be allowed the same previliges? Will the platers be told that Sarwans word is law on the field or else? (Since its his head)
And some of you should stop using the mound as an excuse for WICB that is leons ago and buried or else dont consider Sarwan at all as a result. If they still hold that in mind then 'badmindedness' fits.
I for one think the 'robation' is political and that a power broker in the WICB gang has another person in mind and is waiting for the first opportunity to pounce and name that person. Problem is that perosn may not yet or cannot claim permanency in the team, as weak as it is and that says a lot about WICB prtejudices.
In reply to DAVE400
As Dukes say, dat would be a logical assumption. After all, it became public knowledge that Gordon supported Ganga for the captaincy.
I wonderin if Gordon act alone and insist on probation or if others had concerns too.
In reply to imusic I wonderin if Gordon act alone and insist on probation or if others had concerns too.
When Gordon announced that Lara would be the new captain,did he say anything to suggest that the 12 Directors had not been informed of the decision?
Did he say that the selection committee had nominated Sarwan for the job?
I guess the point I am making is that we only know these facts because we are on CC.John Q Public has no idea because the WICB is a secret cabal!!!!
Why do you think that the most important thing as far as KG is concerned is CONFIDENTIALITY?
That was NUMERO UNO on his list of priorities.
He is a COCKROACH and is AFRAID of the LIGHT.
If we shine a light on him he will RUN AWAY like FRIGHTENED COCKROACH
The best thing now would be a tour of England. Playing some cricket, having whiped clean the slate after World Cup. That's what we need.
In reply to CaribbeanCricket.com
Supporting sarwan 100%. No one expects him to do it well I hope he does and shines in this moment of Darkness.
In reply to Dukes
Strange that man eh get no inside info on who demand probation.... certain posters had de scoop before..
In reply to DAVE400 Give it a couple of days and then we will see.
In reply to Sydney277
who knows the captaincy could make him a better player. yuh never know.
De selectors REJECT Ganga as cappo. He must now establish himself in the team based on batting performances. He may be de next cappo ONLY if he establish himself
In reply to SuperG
So it came down to Sarwan and Ganga...only those two?...thought there was another horse in the race..like dat other horse eh move at all..
In reply to DAVE400 Which other horse?
In reply to anandgb
it wasn't a three horse race for captaincy?...ah thought dah is wha ah hear ...but it look like de other one eh move at all. ...after being proposed...8)
In reply to DAVE400 Sly Joseph?
In reply to anandgb
nah ...them say he eh move he foot at all..me eh know wha happen .. 8)
In reply to DAVE400 OH you mean Devon Smith then. :lol:
In reply to anandgb
Go ahead and look for you war from VOR dem..
glad you know is ah opener though..
In reply to DAVE400 :lol: :lol: :lol: That gentleman did say that Sarwan is ahead of him. He has no aspirations to back stanb his buddy. :lol:
In reply to DAVE400
Sarwan is infected with the same disease of indiscipline. Can he then call for discipline? That will be his challenge.
In reply to anandgb
Ah eh no doctor..but ah got plenty patience.... 8)
Congrats Sars!
Show the critics your class!
We fans believe you can surpass!
Obstacles you'll come across!
In reply to Angel What indiscipline you talking about? Really, you need a dose of senna. :lol:
In reply to DAVE400 Your patience will be rewarded better than you expected
In reply to anandgb
but de probation period... 8)
De probation gonna stop him from cleaning out that chink in the armour that is masqerading as an..... :lol:
In reply to sabina
In reply to Cleg
In reply to DAVE400 :lol: :lol:
I doh see what the confusion is about Sarwan's probation isn't it factual that he was dropped for performance issues, that his training practices have been less than anyone elses on the team. that he has shown a distinct lack of willingness to develop himself or even do anywork to maintain his fitness and technique at a reasonable level. The facts speak for themselves of the three cricketers guaranteed a position in the team, Gayle, Chanderpaul and himself, he is the best choice as captain. However, in terms of his position on the team his hold is the weakest unless he maintains his level or improves he and Ganga will be at the same level and well he may lose the captaincy. Therefore it serves more as a reminder to him that his approach to the game if continued will land him out i=of the team and out of the captaincy..
In reply to Dukes
There are Trinidadians with that name also. It is not a name isolated to Guyana.
In reply to slatoy It is simply one added pressure that no one needs. Especially at the start of his stint when he needs to assert himself.
This is not a good message to send at all. The WICB is wanting in strategy.
In reply to anandgb
In reply to Scar
You obviously do not work in HR. Everybody is on probation during the first to third month of employment and from that to a year. The fact is interviews only tell a part of the tale the ability to fit in can only be seen after the persons take up duties and it is only after this you can determine if the person may adapt. The next will be performance goals set at a period within the first year of the contract. Achievement of this will determine the ability to be retained for a longer period.
In the case of Sarwan yes they ought to have known him already so the first ought not to have applied but the other side of it is that absolute knowledge means that you may know that persons weaknesses. Leaders may adjust to their roles and it is probably with all these considerations in mind that they accepted that maybe motivation may be Sarwan's problem and as such giving him a short term goal to achieve as captain may make that problem less of an issue. That being so in my humble opinion that should not have been made public.
In reply to slatoy
In reply to anandgb
All as I outlined the method of contracting. In the case of Sarwan he was already on probation for performances apparently this just carried over to his captaincy. As evidence look at statements made about his over the last two years.
Any good organisation in hiring a CEO sets performance goals - like to increase performance by 5% within the year of review or to reduce costs by a similar percentage. The fact is that without these goals then his performance cannot be measure. Technically unless and until these are met the individual is on probation. In terms of Sarwan as I see it they recognised that he was failing at his personal responsibilities and figured to tie them to his organisational goals. Therefore they are saying that now being captain will not save your job if you are failing as a player. In organisational terms they view him as a good manager but with poor office skills i.e he refuses to use technology, his desk is always a mess, he delivers in other words but he does so in an inefficient manner. In response to this they say to him you are promoted but your goal is to attain the five percent and to attain personal efficiency if not then your contract can be terminated as a result of failing either.
Ramdin for VC!
In reply to natty_forever Ramdin is another one who is not certain of his place
Congrats Ronnie,you deserve it make the most and lead by example.
If you ever need a hero think of our fellow countryman Clive Lloyd.
You are now the prized wicket & King of the mountain.
Congrats ronnie
What if he did not fulfill there probations. Will they give Ganga the captaincy. Will he have probation or this apply only Sars
Hope you and the team do us proud
In reply to Dukes
In relation to the situation with WI cricket and what has happened in the past 12yrs or so, it is necessary to establish some sort of control and this is a good way to start regardless of who is selected as captain. However, as I've mentioned before this MUST be a pattern in ALL aspects of the Board right down to the players. Dukes, do you believe these guys have any sort of respect for anyone and discipline towards their work ethics?