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Concacaf Nations League

FanAttick 2023-09-09 03:04:27 

Reggae Boyz 1, Honduras 0

T&T 1, Curaçao 0

nitro 2023-09-09 03:26:40 

In reply to FanAttick

That should have been 2 luv! Bobby Reid scored.

Trinity 2023-09-09 04:41:36 

Agreed, should have been 2-0. Sets up the Reggae Boyz nicely. Just need to get the midfield to perform better and increase pass accuracy/ball retention.

JoeGrine 2023-09-09 12:05:18 

In reply to Trinity

Coach Grim needs to fix whatever it is that keeps Ravel Morrison out of this team. The CONCACAF teams respect Ravel you can see it in how they play Jamaica with him on the pitch. Kasey Palmer is no Ravel Morrison EXHIBIT 1 - he lacks the ability to provide himself as an outlet for the defenders to get the ball up the field.

For the first time I saw a deliberate attempt from Jamaica to move the ball up the field on the ground instead of the "outta-mi-life" kicks up the field. You need a confident midfielder who is a presence on the field to facilitate this and Ravel Morrison is that man!

FanAttick 2023-09-09 12:08:13 

In reply to JoeGrine

Magee could be an option in midfield…and hopefully Mason Greenwood will provide another attacking option soon lol

nitro 2023-09-09 12:16:33 

Link TextIn reply to JoeGrine

nitro 2023-09-09 12:21:22 

In reply to JoeGrine

Rooney was working on having Ravel back in DC United however they have salary cap issues.

I saw Ravel posting on IG that he is back in England to sort himself out. Antonio says Ravel should be playing in the EPL if he could sort out his issues. Would be helpful to know the problems with him.

nitro 2023-09-09 12:25:47 

In reply to FanAttick

The coach made some adjustments in the 2nd half by playing Palmer higher up the pitch and using Joel as the lone CDM, a pivot I think you experts call it. He also added a 3rd midfielder. In essence we were playing a 4-3-3 system. We looked much better.

He needs to cut out this 4-4-2 system. The 4-3-3 enables the team to play to its strength, the super talented wingers.

nitro 2023-09-09 12:28:54 

Grenada did well to draw with the hyped up Suriname team.

JoeGrine 2023-09-09 13:07:56 

JoeGrine 2023-09-09 13:09:44 

I cannot speak to his present "issue" but Ravel is known to lack off the field discipline and as a man who dances to his own tune. Football is a team sport......

I agree that Grim cannot coach the 4-4-2 with the personnel he has at his disposal.

JoeGrine 2023-09-09 13:14:55 

In reply to FanAttick

I have time for Magee, however, at this level there is something missing from his game, perhaps it could be something as small as.....playing time.

He is a very poor man's Ravel Morrison.

nitro 2023-09-11 10:43:52 

Trinidad getting the job done, 3-2 over El Salvador. Congrats Soca Warriors.

imusic 2023-09-11 12:05:33 

In reply to nitro

Pleasantly surprised at the results for T&T

Not convinced by the coach tactics.

1st game we had 1 shot on goal and won 1-0

This game we had 3 shots on goal and won 3-2

But a team that cedes possession as much as we do and has limited attacking options isn’t going to consistently get these results.

I’ll take it though

Acid 2023-09-11 12:33:12 

In reply to imusic

1st game we had 1 shot on goal and won 1-0

This game we had 3 shots on goal and won 3-2

That is some efficiency big grin

I see in both cricket and football they are top of the table.

Barry 2023-09-11 19:14:13 


FanAttick 2023-09-13 02:02:41 

Reggae Boyz 2, Haiti 2

Reggae Boyz trailed 0-2 at half time

Chrissy 2023-09-13 02:07:42 

In reply to FanAttick

Good - I posted the HT score

JoeGrine 2023-09-13 02:08:18 

A few points about the game:

1)You appointed Leon Bailey “must start” for reasons unknown to those of us who know football. The only “must start” on any Jamaican team is Ethan Pinnock and possibly Demari Grey.

2)Whatever beef you have with Ravel Morrison you better resolve it as if you don’t you will be looking for a job soon. Kasey Palmer is in deep waters as a creative force. He is more ineffective than an elephant on ice skates.

BLAKE - cannot be blamed for any of the goals
BROWN – his waywardness resulted in the Haitians second goal, He should not be staring on this Jamaican team. Give Gray a chance at least as a place holder until Lambesika returns
PINNOCK – coach Grim’s secret finally exposed. Pinnock is his creative midfielder. He had more creative passes than Palmer and Lattibudierre combined.A rock solid defender who is clearly a cut above all else on the field of play.
LOWE – showed again he is just a decent defender, nothing special.
BELL – not one of his better games. He lacks offensive thrust his one shot on goal notwithstanding. Greg Leigh is better at the position as a two-way player.
REID – workmanlike but not threatening. Kept his head to score a penalty.
PALMER – by my count had two passes which went to teammates. Was missing in action when called on to be an outlet to the defenders. The Haitians gave us tons of space up to midfield disrespecting his prowess to create.
LATTIBUDIERRE – decent defensively but offers absolutely nothing going forward. Lambert is his equal.
BAILEY – why is he even in the stadium is beyond me.
NICHOLSON – for those locally biased we now see clearly he is not the finished article. Antonio plays in and scores frequently in the Premier League for a reason.
GREY – Haiti ensured he was surrounded by at least two defenders for the most part.

Chrissy 2023-09-13 02:10:20 

In reply to JoeGrine
Love your grades


JoeGrine 2023-09-13 02:12:37 

In reply to Chrissy

"They" will come after you so be careful. big grin

michaelmax 2023-09-13 02:25:58 

In reply to JoeGrine

So the same problems and same issues with the same culprits. Bailey selfish and game poor. Nicholson misses more chances than he scores. Midfield is generally useless. Reid MIA as he is more often than he is not. Yh seems like some new fresh blood is needed since this has been an issue with THESE players for a while.

michaelmax 2023-09-13 02:27:22 

In reply to JoeGrine

So the same problems and same issues with the same culprits. Bailey selfish and game poor. Nicholson misses more chances than he scores. Midfield is generally useless. Reid MIA as he is more often than he is not. Yh seems like some new fresh blood is needed since this has been an issue with THESE players for a while.

FanAttick 2023-09-13 08:06:52 

In reply to JoeGrine
In reply to michaelmax

BAILEY – why is he even in the stadium is beyond me

Take your biased blinkers off..Bailey was involved in both of the Reggae Boyz goals…
I wouldn’t say he had a great game but he did his part…
The defense aside from Pinnock was poor and Nicholson couldn’t hit the side of a barn with a Banjo

JoeGrine 2023-09-13 09:09:08 

In reply to FanAttick

I was waiting for you.

Can you imagine if I had commented on Richards? big grin big grin
Meaning you are the one with biases. I call it as I see it, I don't care if the player is my family, played for my high school, went to my church or........came from a club that I worship at (note - unlike you I have no such club or academy).

Back to Bailey, for me, he has been useless as player since he got into the Jamaican team. Are there better players currently in the squad or among the pool, well, of that I am not sure, however, he has not done anything to show that in the Jamaican colors he is better than Parris for example.


1) hold head down and dribble into a bunch of opposing players.
2) makes an occasional "chip" pass that finds his teammate. Now I know why he got that nickname.
3) makes as many passes to teammates as he does to the opposition.
4) his dead ball kicks (corners/freekicks/penalty) are nothing special meaning, at least 90% of them are ineffective
5) I will give him credit for away from the ball being an improved player in that he (a) doesn't gesticulate his frustrations at his teammates as openly as he used to (b) he makes the effort now to come back defensively (c ) he is taking on the role of talking to teammates in a more encouraging way
6) I can get Maas Joe or Ms. Janey to do #5 for me absent the hype.

FanAttick 2023-09-13 10:06:52 

In reply to JoeGrine

According to the official soccer rating website Bailey was one of the better players on the pitch….despite the horrible conditions….when he is on the pitch he always causes problem for the opposition defenders and frees up space for his teammates..I understand the anti-Butler cum Bailey bias but I watch as an independent observer and I see things differently to you

nitro 2023-09-13 12:04:50 

I respect Coach Hallgrimsson for taking Iceland from being ranked 104th in the world to entering the Top 20 in FIFA's toughest confed, UEFA. He used Iceland's strengths: well-organized, players in top physical condition (Iceland boasts of some of the strongest people in the world), playing compact defense and launching quick counter-attacks.

You can see he is trying to get Jamaica to play similarly but I am not sure we have the players whether in this squad or potential call ups to fit this style. I think the team is more suited to play more attacking, possession-based football as they did under Paul Hall.

I think the Coach realizes this as well and had the team trying to play this way. We dominated possession with 71%, however, although we had 18 shots to their 9, only 8 were on target. Haiti had 5.
Link Text

I hope he continues to build on this. I hear the media questioning him and drawing Mr. Blake's tongue about if the hunt for new players is over. What nonsense. We need better quality in midfield, defense (especially right back) and strikers.

JoeGrine 2023-09-13 12:21:34 

In reply to FanAttick

"official soccer rating"?

Sir, I gave my opinion which may or may not mesh with "official soccer rating". Since you are such an ardent follower of "official soccer rating" why do you show up for "my opinion"? Why don't you give your player ratings instead of parroting what "official soccer rating" has to say. You do know those are humans as well and they are prone to mistakes and or biases as you say I am? Or you are vouching that they are infallible beings?

I could bring here the opinions of other soccer experts and aficionados who would conclude that Leon Bailey is marginal in the Jamaican vest, however, I just chose to tender my opinion.

Back to Leon Bailey:

What I saw last night was at best a 1/4 decent game from Bailey and so far, I have only seen ONE DEGGE DEGGE decent game from Leon Bailey since his senior call up. That is my opinion and I do not give a hoot about "official soccer rating", I go by what I see.

JoeGrine 2023-09-13 12:31:01 

In reply to nitro

Well said, Grim came in and wanted to impose his style of football on the nation. I am surprised the JFF did not have clarity on all of this prior to his hire or is it that he has deviated from what he told the JFF? We do not have the personnel or the temperament to play 4-4-2. This was obvious from the very first game under his regime.

Anyway, here we are now and to Coach Grim's credit he has seemingly aborted his 4-4-2. I still believe that with what he has at his disposal a 3-5-2 would work best as we need all the help we can get in midfield or what he used last night (4-3-1-2)

FanAttick 2023-09-13 14:28:05 

In reply to JoeGrine

I referenced the official soccer rating websites because they rely exclusively on stats - touches, possession lost, accurate passes, key passes, chances created, ground and aerial duels, dribbles attempted, dribbles successful etc…they have no axe to grind. It’s the same process to evaluate performance whether it be in the English Premier League, La Liga, Seria A, League Un, or International Matches….

I can also do my own eye test to see if the stats comport with what I saw..By that and any other measure Bailey had an ok game..the conditions were not conducive to his style of play but he tried his best…even though he was out on his feet towards the end of the game . I wouldn’t let goats roam on that pitch far less make professional soccer players play..I was keeping my fingers crossed that no one picked up a serious (potentially career ending) injury…

The fact is that the Reggae Boyz dominated Haiti in very aspect - and on a better day with better conditions could have won by 5 clear goals….the return leg looms so we’ll just have to wait and see..

I saw Honduras playing at home vs Grenada last night..I watched up to about the 60 minute mark. The field was in excellent condition. The bounce was true. Players had confidence that their passes would reach the intended target and not stop in a pot hole half was the case at the Office last night….

JoeGrine 2023-09-13 16:10:48 

In reply to FanAttick

We move on.

FanAttick 2023-09-14 10:18:14 

In reply to JoeGrine

Before we move on….This is the Bailey that you and others are bashing?

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore Roosevelt

michaelmax 2023-09-14 16:44:45 

In reply to FanAttick
Fan, the truth is the truth. He has had ONE good game in a Jamaica shirt. He is NOT a TEAM players and wastes opportunities by NOT passing the ball.

XDFIX 2023-09-14 18:19:28 

In reply to JoeGrine

Grim taking notes from Butler!

FanAttick 2023-09-14 19:24:21 

In reply to XDFIX

Grim taking notes from Butler!

In that case, Grim is a smart man! lol

Tappa was taking notes from Speid

FanAttick 2023-09-15 08:51:50 

In reply to michaelmax

Formula Sports is spot on

nitro 2023-09-15 10:49:27 

Bailey had 3 good games out of 5 in the Gold Cup, albeit the poor ones were the big matches vs USA & Mexico. He was average in the Nation's League against teams he should be dominating given his level.

I see Ryan LFC and others beating him for partying and drinking before the Haiti game. I don't know if its true but if it is that could explain him not being at his best. In this case why the Coach played him for 90 minutes? He had Cephas and Whisper.

That said Jamaica should have played these matches in FL on a good surface. The National Stadium field is a disgrace.

FanAttick 2023-09-15 11:10:27 

In reply to nitro

Did you see the bullet header from Bailey against Mexico in the National Stadium to earn us a point in the Nation’s League qualifying?

This partying thing is a red herring….the stadium field in the Honduras and Haiti games was disgraceful….Bailey’s main strength is his dribbling and none of the players could dribble on that pitch…even Demarai Gray struggled on the pitch and said as much in is post match interview..In fact aside from the goal in the Honduras game Bailey’s stats were better than Gray’s….I think most of the Bailey bashing is because of his link with Craig Butler…I see the same people who are bashing Bailey saying that Whisper looked out of place when he was way better than Boza…..

nitro 2023-09-15 11:23:02 

In reply to FanAttick

Did you see the bullet header from Bailey against Mexico in the National Stadium to earn us a point in the Nation’s League qualifying?

Yes, and as I said to you sometime ago he played good under Paul Hall, when he scored that goal. That is why I think Hall's system of play fit our wingers, just a more solid defense was needed. I am sure that Gray, Bailey and Whisper would be best attack in CONCACAF with that style of play and a serious threat in Copa America when Greenwood and Nelson are added to the squad.

JoeGrine 2023-09-15 11:34:21 

In reply to michaelmax

We see the same things!

JoeGrine 2023-09-15 11:37:55 

In reply to XDFIX

Grim taking notes from Butler!

When a new coach (foreign at that) walks in and immediately profess that he is building the team around Leon Baliey, it tells you he is either:

1. astute and wants to be warmly received - especially by those with the loudest mouth
2. not right in the head

Note that both things can be true, simultaneously.

You have a team with Blake, Pinnock and Antonio (they excel at club and national level repeatedly) and you talk about building around Bailey. Comedy central on steroids. Akin to having a cricket team with Gayle - Ganga - Hooper - Lara - Chanderpaul and you say you are going to build around Ganga!

FanAttick 2023-09-15 11:41:25 

In reply to JoeGrine

When a new coach (foreign at that) walks in and immediately profess that he is building the team around Leon Baliey

Wasnt it Paul Hall who said that he was building the team around Bailey? I’ve never heard Grim say that…

JoeGrine 2023-09-15 11:44:58 

In reply to FanAttick

Then Hall is the mad man!

And it is was Martin Luther King Jr. who said it then he is the mad man!

FanAttick 2023-09-15 14:53:52 

In reply to nitro

Eddy Gooner weighs in on Partygate

I didnt realize that the furor around the party was because Bailey went out on Sunday night when the Haiti match was on Tuesday night…

All this time I thought that people were complaining that he pulled an all-nighter on Monday night!

When I was in my mid twenties it was not uncommon for me to go out 7 nights a week and was still able to produce at work.. lol
In fact it is easier for me to remember the nights that I didn’t go out than the nights I did!

JahJah 2023-09-15 15:59:52 

In reply to JoeGrine

Ok, I didn't agree with you before but now that you've likened Bailey to Ganga, I have to draw the line....forcefully.

Yow, Joe, let's keep this shit sane and civil...please.

JoeGrine 2023-09-15 20:21:57 

In reply to JahJah

Apologies - Lincoln Roberts big grin big grin big grin

HumbleCalf 2023-09-15 20:45:07 

In reply to JahJah

He definitely went too far there. big grin big grin big grin

What the french is JoeGrine smoking!!

FanAttick 2023-10-16 01:59:00 

Jamaica 3, Haiti 2
Gray, Bailey and Nicholson on the scoresheet

Bailey was @JoeGrine’s MOMbig grin

T&T came from behind to beat Guatemala 3-2

nitro 2023-10-16 02:54:04 

In reply to FanAttick

Bailey made some Ronaldino style passes tonight. He was brilliant.

We need some midfield.

FanAttick 2023-10-16 10:01:42 

In reply to nitro

For a moment I thought Bailey was Leon Debruynebig grin

nitro 2023-10-16 11:13:19 

In reply to FanAttick

I am impressed by T&T results. What an improvement!

JoeGrine 2023-10-16 13:35:10 

My (not what the "experts" say) take:

1. The field was poor.
2. Glad to see Coach Grim departing from the 4-4-2. It appears he went with a 4-2-3-1
3. We need a CREATIVE midfielder. Johnson is an ATTACKING midfielder, there's a significant difference between the two and against good teams it has shown and will continue to show. Coach Grim, don't you think you have punished Ravel Morrison enough? If not, try Magee!

GK : Blake (7.0) didn't have much to do and cannot be faulted for the two goals. He is showing better ball distribution with his feet.
LB : Leigh (9.0) Jamaica's best left back and for me our second best defender (Pinnock aside). Coach Grim, plant the man there and let Bell and Lawrence watch a two-way defender go to work!
CB : Bernard (7.5) showed he can step in with the absence of either Lowe or Pinnock without much dropping off. He is surely not the finished article but promising.
CB : Lowe (7.5) a steady game from him and he avoided being carded which is always a plus for him.
RB : Lembisika (7.0) a much better game than last week. Went a bit forward more than customary.
CDM: Lattibudierre (7.0) a much better game than last week. I'm still not sold on him being on the field as a starter.
AM : Johnson (7.5) a very good game distributing and defending.
RW : Grey (8.5) a few miscues aside, a man the CONCACAF defenders fear. Would love to see Coach Grim switch him and Bailey during matches to test the opposition's lineup.
LW : Bailey (8.5) easily his best game ever for Jamaica. Made a few errors but also helped out defensively.
??? : Richards (6.5-7.0) (was that a "withdrawn forward" position?) would have preferred him off the bench than Nicholson, but he held his own.
F : Antonio (8.0) he did EVERYTHING except scoring.
F : Nicholson (7.5) scored a decent goal and was constantly moving forward.

XDFIX 2023-10-16 16:06:34 

In reply to JoeGrine

GK : Blake (7.0) didn't have much to do and cannot be faulted for the two goals. He is showing better ball distribution with his feet.

His reaction time was too slow re that last goal from Haiti. The goalie in the Grenada match was more impressive to me! I would give Blake a 6!

Do you think Whisper is being played in the wrong position?

JoeGrine 2023-10-16 16:57:50 

In reply to XDFIX

Noted on Blake though I would not agree with you about the goal, as it was very well placed.

Richards, what is his best position on THIS national team? I am not even sure. You cannot play his above Antonio and you cannot play him wide left above Gray so it is either wide right (Bailey) or behind Antonio where I think his need for space is compromised. As the team is constituted I find it hard to say.

nitro 2023-10-16 18:25:54 

In reply to XDFIX

Whisper is best used as a winger but you have Gray, and Bailey above him. Probably Cephas as well.

XDFIX 2023-10-16 19:01:47 

In reply to nitro

To be honest, I rate Whisper over Bailey!

Acid 2023-10-16 20:56:58 

In reply to FanAttick

T&T came from behind to beat Guatemala 3-2

T&T came from behind to beat Panama too. Looks like Angus Eve has a good fighting spirit in this young team.

The refereeing at the CONCACAF level leaves much to be improved on. The Guatemala striker was a full yard offside for that 1st goal. Not sure how the linesman could have missed that shock

Extended Highlights

nitro 2023-10-16 22:15:27 

In reply to Acid

El Salvador, not Panama. T&T did not play Panama in the league but still a great show by the Soca Warriors.

FanAttick 2023-10-16 23:07:05 

In reply to nitro

Guatemala..good comeback by the Soca Warriors

imusic 2023-10-17 04:22:55 

In reply to Acid

Have you actually seen T&T play?

We have had a string of good results since the Gold Cuo and that’s great.

And as you mentioned, Eve has obviously instilled a fighting spirit in the team that has been very commendable.

Still, in every one of those matches since the Gold Cup, we’ve been outshot, out possessed, and dominated by the opposition in every area of the game except the one that counts the most.

As we move on to play better teams, that will not continue.

Time will tell whether we’ve truly improved to be one of the top teams in the region outside of the top 5, or that the Gold Cup results are a truer indication of where we are with our football.

I am hopeful, yet remain skeptical.

FanAttick 2023-10-18 02:56:46 

Curaçao 5, Soca Warriors 3
Panama 3, Guatemala 0

Both advance to the QF

Acid 2023-10-18 03:00:08 

T&T really played a rubbish game tonight but they got their points in the earlier matches

3 penalties for Curaçao

granite 2023-10-18 10:17:22 

In reply to Acid
We have been outplayed in every match that we won so far,that is understandable because we are playing without 6 starters,why should TT think they can win matches without them,that's good experience for these players but it leaves us short.This ref was mad about penalties,one was surely not a penalty.TT must get those players for their next match.