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13 at a strike rate of less than 100.

Batted in two games, chasing 170 and 180.

Even in T20s, he’s a liability

In reply to brians_da_best

I think some peeps on this board don't understand that simple piece of logic.
Insularity steps in and objectivity goes out the window.

Some peeps are just CORNFUSED by all that.

M Samuels 12.66

Carlos 8

Who alone is a liability?

In reply to Cornfused

Why you keep arguing for Ramdin when we have already said all of the above should not be on this team?

That entire team needs to be gutted and some significant thought process has to go into rebuilding.

In reply to Cornfused

They should all be dropped

Brian has and others have been against Ramdin for most of his career. Call it insularity or racial bias whatever it shows how disjointed we are as a people. Ramdin is the best gloveman period. Shai and Dowrich cannot compare to the glove work of Ramdin in any format. Show me who is at least proficient behind the stumps and we may have a keeper. Until then the constant tirade against Ramdin has no value for our cricket.

In reply to Cornfused

Argue on series stats. And career stats.

I can post them here for you if you want

Check here

Check here

In reply to brians_da_best

In other words, Ramdin is a skunt. Again.

In reply to Drapsey

Even nurse averaged more than ramdin with twice the strike rate

In reply to embsallie... you say serious thought process, then waan gut the team. When all that is required is thinking leadership.

In reply to brians_da_best... the less said to you the better.

In reply to natty_forever

Because you have nothing to say. His bat did all the talking

In reply to brians_da_best

You are just a dumb hypocritical kunt....

Flectcher av 18
Nurse 16
Randin 13
Samuels 12
Brahwait 8
Paul 2
Lewis 1

And you are arguing who did BETTER than Ramdin

Look learn something about cricket....and less about the players

In reply to Narper

Now post the number of runs and the strike rates of the players you mentioned.

In reply to Narper

Fletcher scored 56 runs including a 43
Nurse had a strike rate of 180
Ramdin scores 26 runs at an average of 13 and a strike rate of 89
Samuels, brathwaite and Lewis should be dropped too
Paul batted number 9, and his stats don’t really factor into this

In reply to brians_da_best

I have posted the link to the stats since last night

Examine the stats...if you see any significant difference ( total runs, SR and Ave) in the batting of the players I named....go learn some cricket.

Ramdin alone did not lose this series for WI...

In reply to brians_da_best

2 matches is hardly able to judge..

But I have no idea what genius decided Russell should bat at 3 and ramdinat 5.

And if you thought Ramdin was the key liability you must be myopic.

Ramdin should be in the test team not T20 and never at 5.

Did you follow this one in April 2018

Or this one May 2018[

In reply to Narper

Over 10 years of international cricket, you’ll find the odd good performance. The truth is he struggles to average 25 in any form of the game, in over 10 years of playing at this level.

He’s anyway out of the test and odi team, I doubt he’ll be around in t20s much longer

In reply to Narper

Curry goat match?

In reply to brians_da_best

I have no problem if you are an equal opportunity basher of poor performances....but you are not

You were one here championing Devon Smith only a month ago...you were insisting he be given a long run...I don't need to repeat here his stats and how long he played

You called Ramdin a skunt...for years...opening multiple threads per match....YET you were here during the test series calling for respect for Smith...stating that he did not select himself

BTW...Fletcher has played for 10 years,,,,how much better is he than Ramdin...I don't hear you calling for his head

Fletcher

Ramdin

In reply to Narper

He really chooses his statistics in a dishonest way to prove a dishonest point...averages over the last four are really different,

In reply to Narper

Ramdin had a SR of 233 just 4 games ago

Swear brian just obsessed

In reply to brians_da_best

The guy is 33 chill now oh god

In reply to Narper

How many opportunities has Fletcher had, vis-a-vis ramdin?

Before this series

44 off 25
42 off 18

No mention of that lbw decision eh....

In reply to Starzz

By that logic Devon smith got a 50 in his second last test and should be immune from criticism

In reply to doublecentury

Okay, let’s post his career averages. Up for a debate on those?

In reply to doublecentury

He struggles to average over 25 in any form of the game over 12 years. He’s already been kicked out of tests and Odis. I don’t see him stay in t20s after this either

In reply to brians_da_best

Small sample size dude...Evin Lewis made 3 runs from 2 innings (avg 1.5); Carlos 16 runs from 2 innings (avg ; Samuels 38 runs from 3 innings (avg 12.66)...It's not like Ramdin was the only one who didn't have a great series, so very unfair of you to single out his performance. He got a bad decision in his first innings, was 3rd top scorer in his second innings and he contributed with the gloves.

I expected a lot more from Fletcher and Lewis at the top to be honest.

Booyah!

In the recently concluded WI v Bangladesh test series, the incumbent West Indies wicket keeper only scored 22 runs in 3 innings. Should he be dropped?

In reply to Brucie

The incumbent keeper was man of the series in the series just before. When was Ramdin man of the sewries?

We thrashed Bangladesh 2-0. We lost this series to Bangladesh, there will be consequences

By that logic, given the number of poor series Ramdin had, hell he barely had a good series over 10 years, he should have been dropped many years back.

In reply to brians_da_best… well lets see it after a few more series, as your peeps was allowed after shyting up himself during the series with SL.

In reply to natty_forever

Yes, let's see.

In reply to brians_da_best

Ramdin was man of the series against Bangladesh in 2014. He was then wrongly dropped the following year.

Do your research before posting bro.

In reply to Seechy

Bai, you gon mek the man take back track and run away.

Seems like his agenda driven postings are being fact-checked....and he is being fact-up, or down.

Yeah allyuh talk nah!!!

Ramdin should not only be playing he should be captain of both ODIs and T20s

In reply to natty_forever

Here here!

I would make R. Powell Cpt.

Ramdin avg is 18 in T20 and 25 in ODIs.

That is poor.

In reply to Gun_Play… and what are they for the present captains?

In reply to Gun_Play

I don't see how you can judge by a T20I average of 18 and say that justifies Ramdin being dropped. Ben Stokes has a T20I batting average of less than 15 and a bowling average of almost 50 yet he is a sure pick for England despite his poor averages.

Although his average doesn't show it, Ramdin has been contributing to the T20I team with both bat and gloves recently.

In reply to Seechy

Ramdin has a mediocre average in all formats. Period. Debate on stats, I'm open to it.

In reply to Seechy

So in 10 years you find one series in which Ramdin was mos. And you actually posting it to an an argument?

I stated dowrich's mos in tests. When was Ramdin mos in tests?

Are there other instances in which he was mos in any format? Instances other than against a Bangladesh that was extremely weak back in 2014.

In 10 years, is one mos sufficient? Dowrich has one against Sri Lanka already!

In reply to brians_da_best

… and they are world beaters now?

In reply to natty_forever

Exactly. That's how much he's regressed. Averaging 13 against them!

So you agree in 10 years he has one mos against bangladesh!

In reply to brians_da_best

It's not very often that WI players win MoS awards in Tests anyway dude. To win the award the team would actually have to win or draw the series and they only tend to do this against the weaker teams (and occasionally Eng, NZ, and SL).

So you try and suggest a WI batsman from recent times who has consistently won MoS series awards against test teams other than Bangladesh? I bet you can't

So I don't really see your point of trying to compare no. of MoS awards between Ramdin and Dowrich...both average under 30 anyway and provide similar results with the bat, but the fact is Ramdin is the better keeper.

In reply to Seechy

Dowrich is a better batsman than Ramdin. He's played one third of the matches Ramdin has, and has equipped himself very well so far with the bat.

In reply to brians_da_best

Hahaha, and how much did Dowrich average in the test series against Bangla?

A measly 11 from 3 innings! Or you gonna pretend that Dowrich didn't regress after his heroics against SL?

In reply to brians_da_best

So why not play him just as a specialist bat then? Maybe his stats will get better...leave the gloves to someone better equipped.

In reply to Narper

Question:

Is he wrong? No.

So you may not like that he picks on Ramdin but why bother defend Ramdin?

At 33 I do not see a point in persisting with him. I rather see Chandrika stink up the joint at 21 vs a 33 year old proven failure continue to prove just that.

Same goes for Shai, Blackwood, etc.

In reply to nick2020

I want you to show me where I defended Ramdin on this thread...

I merely called out the hypocrite by supplying some stats


BTW...A message board bully who publicly repeatedly calls a player a skunt should be able to defend himself...did he ask you for help?

In reply to Seechy

He is a wicketkeepr batsman. A young player who should be allowed to grow in the team. Unless he fails, he should be persisted with, and he can become one of the pillars of this team for the next ten years.

Whether he develops to his potential, only time will tell. But he’s had a good start to his career

In reply to nick2020

Exactly

In reply to Seechy

What else should I judge him by if not his avg????

Ramdin has played 65 t20s with an avg of 18.

Ben Stokes just 22 matches.

Ramdin doesn't ave over 25 in any form of cricket!

He has played over a decade.

He is poor!

In reply to Narper

I am not here to defend anyone.

Ramdin is not the answer just let the new crickets find their way. Time to move on from Pollard, Sammy, The artist now known as DJ Bravo and company.

In reply to brians_da_best… yeah the same team you biging up your peeps for being MOS against. go figure!

In reply to nick2020… guess you love losing. Based on our cricket players going take awhile to develop, just when them showing they have arrived you drop them. Now you bring him back for one series and have chat. He deserves as much chance to fail as Dowrich recently got.

In reply to natty_forever

No he got a MOS against Sri Lanka. Sri Lanka and Bangladesh are different countries, didn’t you know?

In reply to natty_forever

He failed for 10 years man. How much longer you want to give him

In reply to brians_da_best… 3 more, as he was showing signs of improvement up to that aborted tour of India, then his in and out has not helped. Came to dung-heap and average over 50. Lets give him a "bajan run" and see.

In reply to brians_da_best….

… so he was missing against Bangladesh?

A notice he keeping don't count.

In reply to Gun_Play

Geezer, you really need to look at the stats properly before you post.

Ramdin averages 25.87 in Tests, 30.96 in FC, and 28.49 in List A. So your statement regarding him not averaging over 25 in any form of cricket is incorrect - stop plucking "facts" from thin air!


Fella, when judging T20 players you have to look past the batting average. When batting down the order and during the slog overs there is simply no time for players to be concerned about averages - they are too busy hitting 6s or getting out trying.



If you're looking for a better comparison against Ramdin's 65 T20Is there are many, including the following all rounders and wicket keepers: Russell (17.88 from 47); K Akmal (21.00 from 57); Afridi (17.92 from 99); Mushfiqur (20.94 from 74). When taken together, these averages equate to an average of 19.4 from 70 matches. Not too dissimlar to Ramdin's 18.4 from 65.

All those players boast mediocre/poor averages similar to Ramdin, but have regularly been picked for their teams and are seen as star players in T20s. So why the bias against Ramdin when he's performed no worse than those cited?

Sometimes you have to look past the averages. Ramdin has had good T20I performances recently, did well as a finisher in Pak and Eng. He would provide a better captaincy option than four-sixes-Braffit.


He must be doing something right if the selectors have kept him around for 13 years. If he was consistely poor a la Browne, Baugh et al., then he would've been dumped permanently years ago. He's obviously the best we have at the moment.

In reply to brians_da_best

He has proven to be match winner before. Give him a run in T20Is until the next World T20 at least.

It would be good to get the dream team back for a successful defence of the title.

In reply to Seechy

You must be Ramdin's father.

Picking and choosing stats to help your argument.

All of those players you mentioned were dropped!!!!!

25.87... At Test level. I apologise... those are glorious stats.

Then you post stats on FC and List A.

What about his international stat?????

The man is a poor batsman. Leave it at that.

In reply to Gun_Play

Haha, wrong again my friend!!!! Russell just served his 1 year ban and is back in the 1st XI; Akmal was out for bit yes but is now the incumbent T20 WK having recently played against WI in March; Afridi retired on his own accord; Mushi is the incumbent keeper for Bangladesh and just played in the recently concluded T20I series! How the fcuk were all of those players dropped?! They are all stars/have been stars of their respective nations.


You are wildly confused mate. I'm merely doing the research which you couldn't be bothered to do (or weren't capable of doing). I am showing you the evidence to prove your wild assertions wrong. I didn't pick and choose stats; I am showing you the stats relevant to your claims. His international averages are 25.87/25.00/18.43. I'm not arguing that they are glorious averages, no not at all, but simply that your assertion that he "does not average over 25 in any format" is FALSE.

As for the players I mentioned, I tried to make it a fair comparison and choose keepers and all rounders batting in similar positions to him. Yes there will be keepers that average better than Ramdin (Buttler, de Kock, Chandimal), but that is because they tend to OPEN the batting. But players batting down the order (5-7), like those I cited, tend to have lower averages and still command a place in their team.

The same goes for Ashley Nurse. Has a piss poor bowling average but always seems to be the first choice spinner. Why does he deserve a long run and not others?


YOU may think that, but why drop him from the T20I team just because of his 18.46 average? He has given a few good performances recently and deserves a run.

In reply to Seechy

I can't continue debate with you.

Oh, I forgot to give him 0.87... my bad

PATHETIC!

Arguing about a player who's batting is so abysmal in all forms of international cricket is a waste of my time.

A run??? After playing a decade of cricket...smh

You clearly have a bias towards this player so there's no debating you.

In reply to Gun_Play

Bro, Ramdin batted seven times last Regional Super 50, for an average of 17.37.
After seeing though stats, I place him on my retirement list in all formats.

In reply to natty_forever

Because we haven't been doing this with Ramdin & Co. for the last 18 years?

I rather lose in a rebuilding effort than stick with proven failures. But I guess some other people rather us lose better and have no future.

Tek dat

TKR 195/6 (20.0 Ovs) CRR: 9.75

Denesh Ramdin *50 (27

In reply to Gun_Play

Really??? His batting is abysmal in all formats???

Then why de was did he crack 50 from 27 balls with 2 fours and 4 sixes and help his team to victory last nigbt!

Shotta on fire!

You clearly have bias AGAINST the man so kys.

In reply to openning

Retirement list in all formats ey? Did he not score 50 from 27 in the T20 last night and help his team to victory huh??

You can go eat some humble pie too with your biased comrades Gun_play and BDB.

Yeah all huh talk nuh!