Message Board Archives

What happened to him?

In reply to solidrock
Good enough to be rated in the fast bowling top10 in the world in the late 70s early 80s. Unfortunately given the strength and depth of our resources in those days he was never really higher than 5th choice for the WI test bowling attack.

In reply to solidrock

was wayward at times in a very competitive environment.

like sylvester clarke,winston davis,he played in a era with to much talent

Wayne Daniels was fast but erratic and inconsistent too often, he was guilty of bowling too many ' no-balls '. He became better later in his career, but by then there was no place for him in the WI team.

He was a monster at youth league level


Another one was Patterson Thiompson. Bajans has high hopes for Pato......then......nothing.

In reply to imusic

You cant put Wayne Daniel with Patterson Thompson.

10 matches 36@ 25.27 ...a higher bowling average than any current WI fastbowler all sub 30 avg against Aus, Eng and India. His figures suggest a better fast bowler than all we have now.

Wayne Daniel would be spearheading our current attack with Roach and easily a world class first change for Ambrose/ Walsh post 1995

WAYNE DANIEL would easily walk in a WI team from 1950 with Hall and Griffith in the 1960s to 1977 when Garner and Croft arrived to partner Roberts...he still managed to get an occasional play during the dominant pace era.

In reply to velo

exactly.....wayne daniel and vincent van der bijl were a champion bowling partnership for middlesex in the late 70s and early 80s....in a time when viv, clive, greenidge and barry richrds, imran and gower stalked county cricket/......he just could not dislodge roberts, holding, croft or garner and when croft went to SA, he couldn't dislodge marshall.....must be the height of misfortune

In reply to analyst-kid

I’m not comparing the 2 except for the “whatever happened to....” question

Wayne Daniel was a latter day Uton Dowe

Different is, he got to play county cricket at Middlesex and therefore had the opportunity to develop

Dowe didn’t have that opportunity

Both were fast and wild

In reply to imusic

nah hoss.....patterson thompson was ocerweight and had only two lengths ...short and shorter....i have never seen a more nonthreatening bowler in my life

In reply to Jumpstart

Non threatening eh?

Go out and face him nah

word is, there is a movement to have him canonized

In reply to imusic
No comparison. Daniel was a better bowler than Thompson in all respects.

In reply to imusic

No way u put UTON DOWE with Wayne Daniel.

Wayne Daniel in his short career has an

ave of 28.14 vs AUS....
ave of 24.75 vs INDIA
ave of 24.38 vs ENG

...and an even better figures in ODI

Uton Dowe played 4 matches to Daniel's 10, ave 44.50 with 12 wkts

and ave 168.00 vs Aus
ave 35.00 vs Ind
ave 30.25 vs NZ who were the minnows back then.

Wayne Daniel was a member of the initial WI four prong of Roberts, Holding, Daniel and Vanburn Holder in 1976

I am amazed at the lack of knowledge of our past cricketers.Wayne Daniel simply came of age at the wrong time.He not only took 36 wickets in 10 tests at 25 apiece but in an excellent first class career took 867 wickets at 22 apiece.Another excellent fast bowler back in the day was Tony Gray who took 451 first class wickets at 22 apiece.

In reply to Dukes

yeah tony gray was reel unfortunate too.

If you want to find players to put longside Wayne Daniel...you have to look at Tony Gray and Winston Davis.

But remember when u talking Wayne Daniel...you are talking about a fast bowler who has done well against all teams he played against in Test Cricket and ODIs.

In reply to analyst-kid

exactly.....the amount of fast bowling talent coming out of the west indies will never be repeated in the history of the sport....outside of the five or 6 or 7 that played consistently you had....daniel, clarke, stephenson, hartley alleyne, ezra mosley.....bowlers of rare rare skills

In reply to Jumpstart

You did not even mention Tony Merrick and George Ferris.

Holding once had to give Pattersom Thompson coaching on his run up during a break in play OF A TEST MATCH !!

My best memory of him is of a slog for six over cow corner on a tour to OZ.

In reply to Dukes

never heard of those dudes.....but add them to the list....it was a blessing and a curse.

Don't know much about Daniel, was he faster than Tino?

In reply to imusic

I heard of Patterson Thiompson from my former games master, who was secretary of Empire and Barbados scorer, he was almost in tears,
Most former players do not support youngsters, by assisting at practice, he said not once did Charlie Griffith come back to the club, and assist the youngster with his bowling.
I asked a former wicketkeeper if he spend time assisting youngsters at his former club, he said to me, What for.

In reply to analyst-kid/ opening

Can you also comment on these guys, all born within a year of each other; How did the BCA managed these bowler , great talent
Daniel b1956
Alleyne b 1957
Marshall b1958 world great
Moseley b 1958
Stephenson b1959

In reply to Jumpstart

I did not see your post, but I was doing the same research as you were doing, I was amazed that there were born within a year of each other.

In reply to tc1

Bro, County cricket had plenty to do with players development.

Wayne Daniel was a combustible bowler who occasionally produced an unplayable delivery.

Before fast and foolish had a name He was the prototype fast and foolish without the ego and entitlement of Tino I might add


he was a big unit not sure if he had a fridge that was open all hours or whether he was just big boned

Tony Gray,Winston Davis and Franklyn Stephenson were Rolls Royces in comparison .The latter blotted his copybook by going to South Africa during the era of apartheid

In reply to Dukes

A couple of days ago on a cricket podcast Daniel & all those quick bowlers mentioned above were being discussed by Jonathan Agnew the former player & now journalist ( in relation to what is was like to face them as a tailender). There was real sense of awe in his and other guests in the way they described them.

Daniel was capable of extreme pace added to which he hit the bat hard.... heavier than any other bowler he faced.

He played with George Ferris at Leicester and rated him as ‘seriously very fast’. I never actually saw Ferris & Merrick but I do remember them at the time being feared on the county circuit and considered a lot more than just fast.

A proliferation of class bowlers. Furthermore, they were capable batsmen, especially the likes of Stephenson, Marshall and Moseley.

I miss when you had Spartan taking on YMPC, St Catherine, etc.

Hats off to Bim for being the lone country to consistently operating high quality club cricket.

In reply to openning

that does not mean our players were not the most gifted group of cricketers in the history of the game. Australian cricketers went to england during the off season and they were not nearly as successful as our bowlers and batsmen. County cricket was the finishing school for every cricketer around the world in the 70s and 80s because the UK provided the most varied conditions in the world


Point is that clubs and countries usually have to set up academies to produce the talent we produced in the 70s and especially the 80s. In typical west indian style we did not appreciate it and made no efforts to ensure the continuity of world class talent. Its an attitude that pervades west indian society. For example, every year in TT, schools beg for new equipment, desks, boards etc. That is instead of taking care of what they already have. Its sad

In reply to Jumpstart
Ability and gifted good traits to have, but not having the resources to apply your trade, upgrade and continue learning is another.
Club cricket is played in some of Islands, usually on weekends, with each player getting batting 15 minutes batting practice.
That is still an amateurish setting.

In reply to Jumpstart
I agreed with you, our players were already good and solid players, we have the most competitive cricket league at that time.
As Sobers said WI and oversee players saved English cricket during this period. The only player that I remember in the early day of county cricket to fail was Wycliffe Phillips. he was lazy.

In reply to Lamb

I hear you loud, my early years was on the west coast , and I remembered Maple first year in the Div1 with players like Boyce, Shepherd, Phillips, Doyle and Burnham taking on spartan , Empire etc.

In reply to ponderiver

Best way to describe Daniel. Daniel would be bowling fast short and wide and getting hammered to the boundary then alluva sudden BANG! A ball of great pace and accuracy shattering stumps.

But I recall him bowling Viv for a duck with one of those type deliveries....but for some reason he never bowled shyte to VIV....got to be massive respect. I recall Hooper scoring a century against Barbados and taking Daniel to the cleaners however.

The difference between Tino Best and Daniel was Daniel's ability to produce terrific deliveries and bowl some very good spells.

Did you know when Best was running thru regional batting lineups in his debut years...Daniel was his bowling coach?

In reply to tc1
You should talk to John Shepherd, Franklyn Stephenson or Vanburn Holder, they will tell you, what made them professionals.
The club system in Barbados prepared them, but league and county made them the pros they became..
Fidel Edwards and Ravi Rampaul are playing more cricket at their age, then when he was just playing club and West Indies cricket.

In reply to analyst-kid

wow


my earlier post like a shot from sir Everton not a man move

In reply to ponderiver

I know this is a rum shop and off hand remarks should not be taken seriously but Wayne Daniel has better statistics in both test and first class cricket and utilizing any and all matrices when compared to Patrick Patterson who I instinctively know you have great respect for. Rather than attack the bearer of these facts I suggest you look up the facts yourself before responding in Trump like fashion.
Hahahahaha

In reply to imusic

Dude you are so far forking wrong that you almost circle the dial to right!!!

In reply to openning

in this same period when county cricket prepared and developed WI cricketers , England was at the bottom of international cricket.
During this time, Bim , Guy, Jamaica and TnT could hold their own or beat many touring team. I agreed that playing cricket in a structural professional setup would elevate your game.

In reply to tc1

Bro, use your commonsense, These players was in a professional setup, being able to play and practice 24/7
Tell us where in Barbados could these play or practice with the such setup club had and still have?
Cricket in Barbados is still played on weekends, with the exception of Cave Hill, no club has facility for indoor facilities, with gyms, coaches, trainers
Cricket in Barbados is still an amateur sport, with players having 9-5 jobs.
Not the same for cricketer in the county circuit.

Daniel came at the wrong time...simple. My memory of Daniel was an afternoon at Banks. Daniel was picked for West Indies duty but had not played a match yet. He was already big talk in Bim. That afternoon Daniel was very quick and George Braffit was very brutal. Maaaannn George put a real cut ass pon Daniel...licks like peas. Braff score bout 70 odd in about an hour.

In reply to Oilah

My friend, herein lies a major problem when some people talk about players from back in the day.I am not suggesting that you are doing the same but some people ignore the players record and focus on such anecdotes.
Wayne Daniel took 36 wickets in 10 test matches at 25 apiece.He played against 3 teams,England, Australia and India and his bowling average was below 30 against all three.In first class cricket he took 867 wickets at 22 apiece which is only bettered by a handful of West Indian bowlers.Amazingly he is being ridiculed by people on this board who when FACTS are stated run away, only to reappear in some other thread with some similar nonsense about another ex-player.
Between 1974 and 1989,the West Indies produced an astonishing array of fast bowlers and one day I will do a thread to chronicle this.It is MIND-BOGGLING.If in 2020 we had some of these players available at their peak they would be match winners in test cricket.

In reply to Dukes

I am in total agreement with you. Daniel was a very good bowler as his record shows. He was a genuine quick. This event I remember is special because it was the first time I saw Daniel up live and close. I didn't even know who George braffit was and it was so exciting to see a fast bowler bowling fast and a batsman beating it all over de place...imprinted innah mi head

As a youth I was helping in the scoreboard of that year's youth championship in Bim. Daniel was a man among boys during that time. Fast and direct and knew he intimidated all. I think Hubert Chang was one of the few who stood up. Daniel would be the lead fast bowler if he was playing now. Way better than Dowe and only because of the greats guys like him, Davis etc. didn't play many test. Daniel was a top class bowler who many other test teams would have taken in a second. Most who didn't get the chance to see these guys have no clue to how great the talent was back then. Folks need to understand the bowlers made the batsmen better and visa versa. I love Roach but Daniel was a Gabriel on another level. Just came at the wrong time.

Now we have a bunch of young batsmen that were not attacked by the fast bowlers and play the game scared. I have watched much of this year's regional cricket before the covid stoppage. Myers is one of the very few batsmen that I have seen that take on the bowlers and actually dominated. The fast bowlers this year keep on coming (Joseph from TnT and GT youth) and the batting was scared all over the place. Someone better teach these youths to hook and pull or they are done internationally before they start.

Massa George was a devil. Will always say he was one that the rest the of West Indians didn't get to see. Peter Lashley and the like couldn't hold a candle to George Braffit! He would take all those greats to the cleaners. Batted like he was on roller skates.

In reply to seaegg99

I was lucky enough to see a lot of cricket at Lords & quite a bit at the Oval in the late 70’s and early 80’s and saw most of the top class players. It was of course a period of great riches. Daniel was a superb bowler and would walk into the current side as both the best & quickest, there is no doubt in my about that.

In reply to Oilah

George Braithwaite beat a lot of fast bowlers not only Wayne. George was good enough to even play for WI in a different era but he could only play a handful of games for B'dos.
Wayne Daniel was as good as his record indicates.

here is a novel idea;by today's standards Daniel would be a shoe in for the west Indies with an IPL and big bash contract to boot

Compared to his peers in the era in which he played (HIGHER STANDARDS ERA) he was found wanting
The selectors thought so too and put him out to grass.....some dunces find this simple statement hard to grasp

Daniel's problem was no balls. Even as a youth he bowled many. Kind of like Gabriel. Was way better than Tino or Dowe. Not a good comparison at all.