Meanwhile, the average Jamaica and small business owners are locked out from getting loans.
Lisa Hanna outlines it here. Link Text
Message Board Archives
2 JAMAICA BANK EXECUTIVES, SALARY $13.6 BILLION
2023-07-30 13:57:01
2023-07-30 14:13:55
In reply to Emir
the average Jamaica and small business owners are locked out from getting loans.
Sorry that I have to say it: One thing (exec compensation) has zero to do with the other (access to loans).
2023-07-30 14:16:11
There is a name for this fallacy - the fixed pie fallacy. Yours in education.
2023-07-30 14:16:43
In reply to Emir
Good read
2023-07-30 14:17:39
In reply to Emir
I bet this is another case of poor journalism, I would bet the figure is a severance package and not salaries. That was my take when first announced.
2023-07-30 14:26:36
For the record, Hylton is someone I have liked over the years — a quiet, unflashy gentleman whose early beginnings rooted him in Glenmuir High School. I love to see individuals from humble beginnings rise to lead.
How condescending is this?
2023-07-30 14:35:26
Whether this massive sum was actual or not, I was shocked because I had only heard of someone earning those salary scales within transnational financial corporations with branches worldwide.
Not sure what this has to do with anything.
Furthermore, given the fact that the entity the executives were claiming from was one whose share price had fallen from $208.79 to $73.53 (as at July 21, 2023) and had failed to pay its shareholders a dividend in the last two years, I was confused.
Not sure where the confusion is. It is not typical for share price to be linked to executive pay, neither is dividend payout. Need more information.
So what I am about to say has nothing to do with my admiration of his character, but whether commercial banks and financial institutions are building and adding value to our country as they should.
It would be useful to hear from the author what she thinks is the "proper role" for financial institutions in relation to a country.
Having looked closely at the group’s balance sheet and income statement, I surmise that there was no real rocket science or creative management behind how most of the company’s income was earned. In the case of foreign exchange gains, all the bank did was establish a differential percentage on what they sold the foreign exchange for. Similarly, the fees, commissions and insurance income would need only a set algorithm to churn them out.
For some strange reason, the author thinks commercial banks are tech companies. Very strange, indeed.
These three areas alone accounted for $74 billion, representing 49.5 per cent of the banks operating income. In other words, approximately half of the bank’s earnings were primarily administrative functions, which in today’s world could see artificial intelligence (AI) managing
This part about AI is essentially true. However, I wonder if she has the same views about the application of AI to journalism, and the implications for compensation.
As I delved deeper into the bank’s portfolio, it was clear that 48.85 per cent or $288.7 billion of the banks loans had been categorised as personal; that is car purchases, home improvement, or individual needs. Moreover, the Government borrowed $34.3 billion from them (directly), representing 5.8 per cent of their loan portfolio. An additional $11.15 billion was loaned to utility companies and, finally, $16.2 billion to other financial institutions — a total of $350.35 billion, representing 59.28 per cent (nearly 60 per cent) of their loan portfolio.
Not sure the point here.
What was glaring from how NCB’s loans were structured was that the management or board of directors decided to have very little risk exposure and were not doing anything tremendously innovative.
See above.
For any economy to grow it needs the best public policies for the private sector to create jobs for its citizenry. For the private sector to thrive it requires money and capital investment. On the national front, the Government should set the priorities for our local economy. I have repeatedly said that export-agriculture, manufacturing, culture, and entertainment give us the most significant global competitive advantage to grow our economy. However, when we honestly evaluate how a person accesses capital from our commercial banks in Jamaica, regrettably, agriculture, manufacturing, culture, and entertainment simply cannot and will not grow.
I'm totally and utterly confused at this point. Seems like she is advocating for socialism. Good luck with that.
NCB, our largest bank, allocates 1.28 per cent for agricultural loans, while the second largest bank, Scotiabank Jamaica, distributed a paltry 0.31 per cent to this sector.
Manufacturing does not fear any better, seeing only 1.47 per cent from NCB and 5.52 per cent from Scotia.
Manufacturing does not fear any better, seeing only 1.47 per cent from NCB and 5.52 per cent from Scotia.
I guess she wants banks to invent credit-worthy investors in these areas. Create them from thin air.
So, for the most part, the bank is taking almost $1 trillion of your deposits and lending them to Government (the most inefficient producers) at a higher rate while it gives you only a fraction of the rate of return on your money.
Clearly, she does not understand how banks operate. She thinks banks "lend" deposits.
Indeed, one of the most confusing pieces I have read for the day.
2023-07-30 14:38:05
In reply to Emir
So like US $86M?
2023-07-30 14:50:00
In reply to camos
I bet this is another case of poor journalism, I would bet the figure is a severance package and not salaries. That was my take when first announced.
Bro, I respectfully disagree with you on this one.
Lisa and others were talking total compensation= salary + benefits. The journalist who did the interview with the banker was simply horrible- she attacked his work, not him as a person.
The bankers used performance to justify his total compensation, her article carefully debunked that justification by analyzing the bank's performance using their own financial statements. I also looked it up.
When the masses cannot get decent banking services and are shut out from borrowing, it necessarily means management is poor.
2023-07-30 14:53:36
In reply to DukeStreet
An enormous amount of money- this is Latin American style and no country can develop with this type of abuse.
2023-07-30 14:58:23
In reply to Emir
The bankers used performance to justify his total compensation, her article carefully debunked that justification by analyzing the bank's performance using their own financial statements. I also looked it up.
Point me to the "analysis" part. Thanks, Emir.
2023-07-30 15:00:52
In reply to Emir
Banking is very regulated, and rightly so, more than 90% of the money in a bank are customers' money ,banks are forbidden from doing certain things, not their own election.
2023-07-30 15:02:17
In reply to Emir
like I said that figure is the managers golden parachute not annual pay!
2023-07-30 15:04:12
In reply to camos
You are right about regulation, so the suggestion about innovation is pure trash.
2023-07-30 15:04:55
In reply to camos
Most likely, but Emir is not likely to know this.
2023-07-30 15:09:42
This is the kind of writing you expect from someone with a Bachelors and Masters degree in Communications. Makes sense now.
2023-07-30 15:10:07
Sowell calls these areas "soft subjects".
2023-07-30 16:47:15
In reply to Sangfroid
Clearly, she does not understand how banks operate. She thinks banks "lend" deposits.
How do commercial banks (like NCB) get money to lend?
2023-07-30 17:18:44
In reply to Emir
Separation package.
Solid points by Lisa re lending policies of banks however there is the need to look at it from both sides. Maybe if the FINSAC enquiry was not a political fight we would know most of the answers.
2023-07-30 17:32:11
In reply to HumbleCalf
How do commercial banks (like NCB) get money to lend?
See fractional reserve banking, and if you feel like getting funky - try endogenous money theory.
2023-07-30 18:03:33
In reply to Sangfroid
Come on, fractional reserve, as the name suggests requires banks to keep a fraction of their DEPOSITS on hand rather than lending it all. If you accept my explanation then by definition banks LEND their deposits.
Endogenous money theory. This is a theory that is controversial, but since I am not an economist, I will accept that Central Banks can impact the supply. I do not believe the traditional multiplier effect applies here because it says that a bank will lend money to a customer who will then deposit that loan with another bank and that receiving bank will then lend the same money thus the multiplier effect. It does not apply because it is still deposits that are being loaned.
With all the above said, one should know their audience and in the article the writer is correct to keep it simple and focus on the traditional view that says banks lend deposits. She was not writing an article for some economics journal.
Regarding her mastery of other areas, e.g., salary vs a one-time separation pay, OK, she could have done better. Unfortunately, a lot of times people write articles and they do not fully understand the nuances. However, her saying banks lend deposits is not incorrect nor does it show a lack of understanding of how banks operate.
2023-07-30 18:14:49
In reply to HumbleCalf
Come on, fractional reserve, as the name suggests requires banks to keep a fraction of their DEPOSITS on hand rather than lending it all. If you accept my explanation then by definition banks LEND their deposits.
No, that is not what it means. It means banks can theoretically lend more than they have in "deposits", limited by the reserve requirement ratio. For further education, see the money multiplier.
Endogenous money theory. This is a theory that is controversial, but since I am not an economist, I will accept that Central Banks can impact the supply.
There is nothing controversial about what banks do, or can do, in practice.
I do not believe the traditional multiplier effect applies here because it says that a bank will lend money to a customer who will then deposit that loan with another bank and that receiving bank will then lend the same money thus the multiplier effect. It does not apply because it is still deposits that are being loaned.
What you believe is irrelevant, it is what the evidence indicate. Again, banks do not "lend out" deposits. In theory and practice, they can loan out more than they have in cash.
With all the above said, one should know their audience and in the article the writer is correct to keep it simple and focus on the traditional view that says banks lend deposits. She was not writing an article for some economics journal.
Reinforcing the miseducation of the populace is not a virtue. She is simply ignorant on the issue.
2023-07-30 18:23:35
In reply to Sangfroid
It means banks can theoretically lend more than they have in "deposits", limited by the reserve requirement ratio.
And this ratio is applied to what, what is it called?
2023-07-30 18:25:53
In reply to HumbleCalf
I did try. I really did. You are exhibit 1.20374849 of my general theory.
2023-07-30 18:31:58
In reply to Sangfroid
OK, we good. Keep it simple. One wise man said “If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough".
2023-07-30 18:35:26
In reply to HumbleCalf
True, but the only thing is - I didn't really explain, I simply gave you guidance on where to look. Good luck.
2023-07-30 18:40:12
In reply to camos Haven't you been reading the the present saga? Two gentlemen were placed on leave on a Monday morning. Purportedltly they had been asked to return 90+ million shares in 2021 . They contended that shares were granted by the Board of Directors.
Now they are trying to negotiate their exit.
2023-07-30 18:48:17
In reply to Chrissy She doesn't have a clue about Foreign Exchange gains/losses, nor Exchange/commision which is used to reflect the differential gained/lost on buying and selling foreign exchange.
2023-07-30 18:49:06
In reply to alfa1975
Daylight robbery.
2023-07-30 18:53:36
JP morgan Chase total assets $3.67 trillion (2022)
(Jamie Salary) CEO salary: He receive total compensation of $34.5 million—a $1.5 million salary plus a bonus of $33 million
2023-07-30 18:55:25
In reply to birdseye
Relevance?
2023-07-30 18:55:35
In reply to birdseye
Diamond is getting a salary plus bonus, not a separation package.
2023-07-30 18:57:20
In reply to cricketmad
How is this robbery, if the BOD approved the incentive package?
I can understand someone saying it's excessive, but robbery?
2023-07-30 19:01:17
In reply to HumbleCalf
How is this robbery, if the BOD approved the incentive package?
Because he believes it's a pass-through scheme à la the one employed by Biden Crime Family.
2023-07-30 19:01:52
In reply to HumbleCalf
The BOD was looking after their mates. Imagine being a share holder only to find out that shares are awarded to executives like confetti.
2023-07-30 19:06:17
In reply to cricketmad
So I do not know the terms, but typically you earn the incentive by delivering on profitability and/or target stock price and so everyone is benefiting.
2023-07-30 19:13:17
In reply to HumbleCalf
How is this robbery, if the BOD approved the incentive package?
there is probably also a regulatory approval for the sum.
Because of the absence of equities options here, these packages would be heavily cash laden.
2023-07-30 19:18:39
In reply to camos Looks like the majority share holder was not aware.
2023-07-30 19:21:17
In reply to alfa1975 he is playing dumb, he should have known,wonder who signed off on it?
2023-07-30 19:25:49
In reply to alfa1975
That would be something if the majority shareholder did not know beforehand.
I imagine the majority shareholder approves members of the Board and those members should be looking out for him and all other shareholders. How is it possible that such large incentive packages are approved without "signoff" by the majority shareholder.
2023-07-30 19:29:36
In reply to HumbleCalf
I imagine the majority shareholder approves members of the Board and those members should be looking out for him and all other shareholders. How is it possible that such large incentive packages are approved without "signoff" by the majority shareholder.
It is possible that such a thing is non-binding.
2023-07-30 20:16:37
2023-07-30 20:47:19
In reply to alfa1975
Those articles do not tell me much, except the 2 are out and they have surrendered a lot of shares.
BTW, this kind of thing happens in the US - executives overpay themselves.
Truth is, I am not sure how much is enough as most C-level people (especially CEOs) give up a lot to fill those roles and deliver for shareholders.
2023-07-30 22:03:36
Camos has no clue. NCB is a highly peofitable company making billions in profits but under the current management its Customer Service has deteriorated to less than zero caused by branch closures, staff redundancies, ATMs short of/ without cash EVERY month end so they could penny pinch and make profits yearly in the billions while not paying dividends to shareholders which is what Lee-Chin is really mad about-the lack of dividends-he could care less about anything else but given the fall off in customer service(it used to be top notch) and customer dissatisfaction, he can use the opportunity to ditch them. Additionally, notjing justifies those salaries but that is the case with CEO and senior management salaries worldwide
2023-07-30 23:03:56
In reply to HumbleCalf
Diamond is getting a salary plus bonus, not a separation package.
What does the heading of this thread say?
Anyway its still an obscene amount of money, some of which, in some way could have gone to help, I want to say some WOKE programs, or even some Work programs to help some less fortunate, funding higher education, help UWI give scholarships, etc. … yes songbird, I did say woke.
2023-07-30 23:31:16
In reply to birdseye
What does the heading of this thread say?
Man, at your age, you should be mellow - not so defensive. I is jus trying to help yuh, I could have blasted you like 'Froid did. Yuh need to sue the airline for mekking you hit your head so bad.
Anyway its still an obscene amount of money, some of which, in some way could have gone to help, I want to say some WOKE programs, or even some Work programs to help some less fortunate, funding higher education, help UWI give scholarships, etc. … yes songbird, I did say woke.
So help me out here, I don't know the guys got any money (stock), since there is some talk of them surrendering shares, BUT, how could this have gone to help the less fortunate?
2023-07-31 00:10:01
In reply to HumbleCalf You have drifted into irrelevancy now.
2023-07-31 02:33:37
In reply to birdseye
What does the heading of this thread say?
the thread says salary but that is not the case, we are saying the figure posted is departure package ,aka 'golden parachute'. Which would include accumulated years of deferred compensation.
2023-07-31 04:52:01
In reply to camos
Pass the headline- whether its a golden parachute, base pay, incentives or bonus it is the same grand bucket of compensation. The crooks at the top simply write their own checks and their board are mere rubber stamps.
I find it hard to believe that you are actually defending these guys. BTW, the bank is poorly run, and even if it was decently managed, that compensation package and final payment is beyond scandalous. Can't hide behind the... it is legal.
2023-07-31 09:10:55
In reply to Emir
Pass the headline- whether its a golden parachute, base pay, incentives or bonus it is the same grand bucket of compensation. The crooks at the top simply write their own checks and their board are mere rubber stamps.
I find it hard to believe that you are actually defending these guys. BTW, the bank is poorly run, and even if it was decently managed, that compensation package and final payment is beyond scandalous. Can't hide behind the... it is legal.
Cosigned!
I find it hard to believe that you are actually defending these guys. BTW, the bank is poorly run, and even if it was decently managed, that compensation package and final payment is beyond scandalous. Can't hide behind the... it is legal.
2023-07-31 11:19:33
"They get so little pay, the ones who clean the mess
Minority sits on top give themselves the best"
---Fire Burning - From the Bob Andy songbook
2023-07-31 11:36:46
Why Do So Many People Think That CEOs Earn Too Much?
Link Text
For entrepreneurs, who usually earn far more than top-tier managers, high earnings are usually a reward for particularly good ideas. The richest people in the world are those who have the best ideas and invent or market products and services that satisfy the needs of hundreds of millions or even billions of consumers. Just think of Larry Page and Sergey Brin, who invented Google, Amazon founder Jeff Bezos or Bill Gates of Microsoft. Of course, Jeff Bezos hasn’t worked a million times longer or harder than the average employee, but he has had great ideas that have been especially beneficial to hundreds of millions of people. Ideas that others didn’t have or couldn’t implement.
2023-07-31 11:40:23
NCB — from 'ugly monkey' to world class
Link Text
But the story was radically different in March 1998 when Hylton was appointed managing director of FINSAC and had the responsibility to urgently turn around the NCB Group, which he said appeared to be facing permanent damage, with broader implications for Jamaica.
2023-07-31 11:40:54
Why Do So Many People Think That CEOs Earn Too Much?
Haven't you heard? Only useless academics and the credentialed deserve those sums. People who contribute little to no value to society, e.g. Kendi and Diangelo, are the real MVPs.
2023-07-31 11:41:58
In reply to nitro
But the story was radically different in March 1998 when Hylton was appointed managing director of FINSAC and had the responsibility to urgently turn around the NCB Group, which he said appeared to be facing permanent damage, with broader implications for Jamaica.
Oh, boy!
2023-07-31 12:21:06
There is some obvious falling out between Chin and the two guys, and a subsequent campaign to paint them as vultures. 
2023-07-31 14:45:42
In reply to nitro
Oh give me a break. We need to stop mythologizing these people because they had ideas. NONE of their ideas would have seen any success if they didn't have WORKERS at all levels who could translate those ideas into reality.
2023-07-31 14:52:53
In reply to nitro
NCB today is NOT world class. You cannot go into an NCB branch for walk-in customer service WITHOUT spending the whole day there. Then month end you cannot get money out of the ATM because you walk into a 24/7 ATM and out of 4 , 1 is working and oh, it's out of cash. You go elsewhere and the NCB ATM is out of cash(not soley an NCB issue but a national banking one) but don't tell mi foolishness bout NCB an worl class. This has NOT been true in several years. I used to receive good customer service. Now Hylton has been in charge throughout this decline. Somehow though they managed to continue laying off staff and closing branches while making billions in profits and continuing to pay themselves handsomely.
2023-07-31 14:58:50
In reply to michaelmax
NCB today is NOT world class. You cannot go into an NCB branch for walk-in customer service WITHOUT spending the whole day there.
I find that condition the same for all banks in Jamaica, spend about 3 hours in line at Jamaica National ,closed the account when it was my turn. The sector ,like a lot of businesses in Jamaica just is not competitive,they don't have to earn your business.
2023-07-31 15:27:44
In reply to michaelmax
laying off staff and closing branches while making billions in profits and continuing to pay themselves handsomely.
That's a worldwide thing with the push towards online banking. Its the same in TT.
It comes with hours-long hold times waiting for phone support.
Same in the US with my accounts there, long wait times for online or phone support.
2023-07-31 16:04:32
In reply to VIX
Same in the US with my accounts there, long wait times for online or phone support.
You have accounts in #murca (problem)my, my, my. please don’t be offended if I say “hypocrite”
2023-07-31 16:09:30
In reply to birdseye
Its a great place to invest, not a great place for people who look like me to live(die) !!!
2023-07-31 16:16:02
In reply to Sangfroid
Kendi
You mean Ibram X. Kendi – Author of ‘How to be an antiracist’ –--- it would seem you didn’t get past the title --- I read the whole book, not out of necessity, mind you
2023-07-31 16:17:58
In reply to VIX Who said you were dumb? Definitely not me
2023-07-31 16:32:07
In reply to VIX
That's a worldwide thing with the push towards online banking. Its the same in TT
Interesting --- my bank now when I go there, I don’t get to go wait on line anymore. They have an intermediary who takes your transaction(s) request to a behind closed doors and bring you back your results
2023-07-31 16:43:41
In reply to birdseye
yeah well is mostly pensioners still going in person to banks, so they catering to you all
2023-07-31 16:50:55
In reply to Sangfroid It's the way of socishitists' playbook - class envy!
2023-07-31 17:01:19
they didn't have WORKERS at all levels who could translate those ideas into reality.
Wern't the same workers employed to the bank before these guys took leadership? What was its financial performance prior to this? Great leadership is a skill, just like playing a sport or creating music. Rare talents earn more than the average person. That's just life.
2023-07-31 17:01:56
In reply to BeatDball
Yes, but at the very minimum I'd expect the author of this shit-piece to get someone in the filed to explain things to her.
2023-07-31 17:09:45
In reply to VIX Man you always have to get you little dig. In my case the bank sold-off their non-premier customers, so they are catering only to clients who maintain deposits in excess of a certain amount…
2023-07-31 17:25:48
In reply to birdseye
the bank sold-off their non-premier customers
Murican things!!
Poor ppl not welcome!!
2023-07-31 19:17:30
In reply to nitro
Umm 2 things. CEOs being rare talents is made up by the same capitalist class who write books or have books written telling us what great geniuses they are. Self praise is no recommendation and my reference was in response to the idea that CEOs are savants.
2. NCB has been profitable ever since the FINSAC debacle when Gloria Knight through Mutual Life damn near crashed the bank. However, the FACT is Hylton has been there right through the POOR CUSTOMER SERVICE which is YEARS old or did you miss that? Or is that you don't think that banks ought to provide proper service to its CUSTOMERS whose money they USE to be profitable. Argue sense.
2023-07-31 19:21:37
In reply to nitro
There are FAR less workers employed. They laid off thousands. Heck THIS year they CLOSED the Cross Roads, Oxford Road and another branch. Of course, this just crowds MORE people into FEWER branches. Why? Company was making billions in profits. That is NOT good management. Hell you can't even CALL Customer Service and get through quickly.
2023-07-31 20:45:40
In reply to michaelmax
There are FAR less workers employed. They laid off thousands. Heck THIS year they CLOSED the Cross Roads, Oxford Road and another branch. Of course, this just crowds MORE people into FEWER branches. Why?
Technology adaptation is going to force even more downsizing be prepared, there are a lot of inefficiencies in Jamaica!
2023-07-31 21:00:01
The banking service in Jamaica has always been poor! JMMB was the best of the lot, but perhaps now join the poor service offerings.
2023-07-31 23:39:04
In reply to camos
Inefficiencies you say. Is it efficient to have less Cudtomer Service agents so that to do 1 simple thing where you have to go in branch takes all day. I mean go in at say 9am and leave at 2pm. That's efficient? Calling Customer Service and not being able to get through is efficient? Closing branches to get customers to use the 24/7 ABMs but the ABMs don't work or only one wotkd when there are several and not being able to reliably get cash after payday, that's efficient? Man stop chat pure rubbish.
2023-07-31 23:42:37
In reply to XDFIX
There was a time I could RELY on NCB Customer Service especially Liguanea. You go in, you get to someone quickly and you are out. But then they actually had staff so you did not go and then find that all stations not manned. I have heard that said about JMMB but they had an issue recently. Don't know if it was just a one off or they are joining the big 2 in crappy service.
2023-07-31 23:43:23
In reply to camos
Yep. Its called oligarchy.
2023-07-31 23:44:20
In reply to VIX
Sigh.
2023-07-31 23:45:47
In reply to camos
Isn't technology adaptation supposed to reduce inefficiency not increase it?
2023-08-01 00:13:02
In reply to michaelmax
Dude whether you or I like it or not that is where things are headed,with online banking banks do not need all the branches they once had and with soon to be popular digital currencies there will be even fewer. Part of the local problem is poor internet service and lack of access to service. 3G internet and rolling blackout may not be enough to facilitate efficiency initiatives.
2023-08-01 04:14:35
In reply to camos
Digital currency not popular in Ja. Low trust population. That still doesn't deal with the fact of EMPTY ATMs. How is THAT efficient? Jamaica is in no way ready for digital anything because too many things rely on cash-local taxi/non JUTC bus, small retailers, vendors etc. Internet services crash, bank POS systems crash heck I've had my NCB debit and credit card become useless because NCB's system crashed. Common sense is doing something WHEN the systems are there, not do it and hope for the best. What about older people? Oh yeah, who cares,right,? Neoliberalism at its dehumanizing best.
2023-08-01 13:35:24
In reply to michaelmax
Those customer pain points need to be addressed, agree with you on that. Lee Chin mentioned that in the news reports so let us see.
The fact is that Jamaica is competing in a global environment. Going digital is important to reduce the cost of doing business. It is not about Jamaica not being ready for digitalization but more about us being left further behind. We have no choice if we want to not just survive but thrive in the global economy.
There should be no reason for you to walk into a bank to do a mere financial transaction given the technology available.
Search
Live Scores
- no matches