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Coming into the first test?!

Is it a question of limited financial resources or just plain ineptitude from CWI in getting quality prep in tour match and tome to help acclimatize?

pitch and weather had something to do with it too.
I've used that explanation to explain Hope's immortal test many times.
Hope would've done well here too if England wouldn't have bounced him out.
Good pitch, little movement and Hope does well in test. Tougher conditions and caught in the arc from
keeper to point if not cleaned up/Lbw early.

In reply to InHindsight

Put it this way.

Oz would never agree to start an Ashes test series in England after ONE warm-up match.

In reply to InHindsight

Yes. Yes . and Yes. Undercooked..players need good matches to acclimate
to weather and pitches and most are seeing England for first time. WI Board has been tardy in this too often.
Its not rocket science.

In reply to SnoopDog

Well said Snooops

I watched and listened to the castigations re First Test..

I sighed and said diddly..knowing full well

After everybody said more time preparing would have been ideal....are some of the same persons who bellyached about the "Poor Batting".

Maas Hubie it has been so for a long time now. Ever since FTP created back to back to back cricket those who has little
influence (like us) nowadays are treated like nothings. When Gayle left his pre-contracted IPL money to join the team
in England Lloyd criticized him for getting there late without a word on what became the norm to arrive and play test
almost imme

In reply to Brerzerk

So both players and administration have been complicit.

In the interest of WI cricket we need to call a spade a spade whether or not it's our hommie

In reply to InHindsight

Truth be told...it goes further.

We simply need to PLAY MORE TEST MATCHES

ICC and other Authorities need to help us out too

In reply to powen001

Yup that why I agreed with Kraig's call for more test .when compared to the big three.

In reply to InHindsight

ineptitude....so typical of CWI. sending an A team to ireland when you had a big series like this coming up just typifies that organization's stupidity

In reply to InHindsight
Yes been saying this from day one. One insignificant warm up vs a 2nd string County XI then bam! Lords! What did we expect? Need to get past this total now!

To sustain cricket the ICC needs income. The Big "3" provides the bulk of that income. To generate that income people need to work and that is why the Big "3" are allotted most of the available work ...... simples!

BTW, when South Africa visit next month they are only playing one warm up match before the tests while the Windies will be match ready coming off the plane from England

In reply to InHindsight

More Test matches, yes. BUT nothing in the ICC rules say that you can't even within the FTP.
WI can work with other r countries and play 3 Tests series. Have they explored that ?
They are going to Pakistan to play 2 and South Africa is coming to the Caribbean to play...2.
Why not add a third.
And why not engage the bilateral mode and even play Ireland ?
It takes money to do so especially if you play hosts under the bilateral banner as years gone by.
But it can be done if the WI have the money to invite a country to play 3 Tests.
I would like to see them do that. They have many venues but NO Money so they stick with the
ICC Test championship schedule which in my view is really crap. Only the top 6 Tests countries should
be playing that while a second Tier of the other 6 play their own schedule with the winner getting
promotion and the bottom placed in the top their demoted.
That would open doors for more Test cricket too.
When has WI last played Zimbabwe in a Test series ? ; Afghanistan ? Ireland ?

In reply to hubert

The ICC should have excluded T20's from international cricket. ODI's should have remained the shorter white ball version of the game in the international arena.

T20s should have remained exclusively in the domestic and private leagues domain.

But the big 3 were so fcuking greedy that they wanted to profit off all three formats knowing fully well that the international calendar would suffer; that player burnout would be a consequence; and more players in the poorer countries would choose T20 leagues over Tests thereby weakening their overall cricket.

Just look at the buzz and excitement all over the world when WI won that Test match in Oz. You simply don't get that in international ODI's and T20's.

In reply to InHindsight

I saw Kaveem Hodge for the first time at Lords and I straight away said he is the best batsman in the present lot of Caribbean batsmen,so far he is the best for the future,he proved it today.Bravo the Dominican,MONTRE LEUR.

In reply to powen001

As you are aware West Indians are with you today and against you tomorrow, everyone has an opinion.
We are aware of the team, with only a few with ten or more matches, I would add Justin Greaves to the fifteen and keep this team together, for the next 4-5 tours.
I will also add 4-5 other youngsters to the group, for the learning experience,
I will not change any of the sixteen players.

In reply to Hubert

i agree with everything you have said. Couple additional thoughts:

More practice games. This is a must

Restructure of WI red ball cricket. We had Headley Weekes for one year and then it was removed. What if we have this in the mid year so as to keep the best players fresh and also maybe some of the IPL players can get some red ball cricket.

What about a minimum of 2 A tours a year so again the better players get more cricket and possibly end up with 14-15 first class matches per year.

What about allowing regional teams to include up to 2 foreign pros in their teams so that our guys can learn from them. We play FC cricket in English and Irish winter and would be playing Headley Weeks in southern hemisphere winter.

We cant depend on English counties to employ our guys so we need to think differently to get our guys exposure.

In reply to hubert

Funny enough...I am all for the other teams to do just that...play among themselves.

and yes the CRY will be about the so called RETURNS on Investment as how many eyes will tune in to up the REVENUE Dollars?

Sad day ..

but the entire world WORSHIPS MONEY now.

In reply to SnoopDog

T20 is too BIG for any reversal. In fact it could be the only viable format in a few years
as the Olympics is gonna have it for the Los Angeles Games in 2028
and with Brisbane due to host the next Games in 2032 in OZ, it could
become THE format .
I grew up on Test cricket as you know but I have to face reality and adjust.
When T20 cam on the scene about 20 years ago, I told folks at my then Club
in Philadelphia that it SHOULD NOT be played by International players.

What was I thinking ?
It is no longer the bread only but butter too.
Happy for the players tho as it is now a rewarding career.

In reply to powen001

Yes sir, MONEY is THE thing. Just hope that humans don't love it too much
as the Good Book has something profound to say about the LOVE of Money.

We are in a different world and humans are probably not making it much better.
Just got to live with what we can't change but don't embrace everything.

In reply to PalsofMine

We and I mean WI cricket can do few things differently and better and you have outlined some
that should be a reality. It just takes right thinking and good implementation for a start.
We can only hope.

In reply to hubert

Agreed. And my comments were not about reversing it. That ship has sailed.

But we are now left to deal with the fallout from the greed and shortsighted decision making from the ICC.

I think the only viable option is to eliminate ODIs altogether with T20's and Tests being the only 2 formats for the international game.

In reply to openning

Global Human nature Opening.

We all see how USA builds up stars and then rips them apart- its the model to keep ppl tuning in and there is $$ in both the journey up and the one down.

NOW - Fans have always been fickle!
that wont change...so I personally pick my battles.

You doubt me?

Read the threads from yesterday...and read them today now for our first innings.

Some very constructive arguments being made on this thread, not sure which one to answer or whether I have major disagreements with any. The consensus though is that:

1)Money makes the mere fly
2)T20 is here to stay and will be the bane of our cricket development as a region
3)despite, 'quality' tour matches (plural) and at time to acclimatize are a must to us being able to even compete in foreign test matches
4)the big 3 are in it for themselves and we'll always be subservient and disadvantaged whatever the case.

This list is not exhaustive

In reply to SnoopDog

I know...I think ODIs could go or at least play less of them and retain the
WC every 4 years. I don't think the bilateral thing with ODIs is as
useful as it once was.
But the ICC is really a big part the problem and it is too political while trying
to serve too many masters when in reality its the Big Three that has any worth.
Other countries are not benefiting as they ought to as the money Pie sharing
could be better.

The idea of only two formats has been mooted by a few folks and it has
merits.However I don't think the ICC will ever go that route.
Cricket is the only sport with multiple + formats...

Maybe the newer countries with the global expansion by the ICC to non cricketing
countries will offer some clarity . I don't know.
One thing is obvious - the ICC is not doing enough to preserve the status of Test cricket
which they claim is the Ultimate format.
Although they have this Test Championship it is not inclusive and the format is not being
pursued greatly or passionately by those countries that are not involved in the Test Championship.

That is of concern and will probably result in the ODI format remaining more viable in present times
as it is easier for newer countries to play than Test Cricket.
I just don't know. But it could mean Test cricket will be played by less countries and ODIs by
all. I would be saddened with such an eventuality.

In reply to hubert

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