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It speaks volume when the stadiums are practically empty for both Test cricket and T-20 internationals, and the weather has nothing to do it with.

Now contrast this to the curry goat cricket called CPL which will start in a few days.

Here's what you'll see:
1. Full stadiums
2 Relatively more expensive cost of tickets
3.Lots of young people and family
4. Very happy faces
5. Patriotic flags even though the tournament is foreign owner club cricket which consume foreign exchange.
5B. Heck, A president of one of the territory, acting as a salesman and promoting the matches and even using the resources of his country to big up players. Allows the old foreign captain of the team to ride on his presidential car to attend juma services.
6. Inter island/territory shameless outburst of insularity and fake pride.
7. People adopting the foreign owned club team as their own flesh and blood
8. Traditional and social Media getting involve for free- doing publicity and stirring up public passion.
9. Big grown old hard back men behaving like children when arguing and debating the game, as if it is their own
10. Young women signs asking foreign players to marry them, shaming their country.

When was the last time did you witness any of these for WI cricket- test cricket in particular?
What has CWI done to kindle some of that CPL passion for our own cricket? Such as growing the sports via the elementary schools?

In reply to Emir

it is. west indies was in decline since 1988, and it just shows how good the players that kept the unbeaten run going were(viv, haynes, greenidge and later pato, ambrose, bish, walsh and finally lara). we started being a lower tier team in 2001, and it has only gotten much worse, with revivals aborted by idiotic cwi administrations. all this predates the big 3 takeover in 2012 or 2013.

alarm bells should have been ringing off throughout the caribbean when desmond haynes, then possibly the most respected man in cricket along with alan border and imran khan, was not appointed captain. brian lara stated explicitly in his book that this decision hurt WI cricket and that it was done simply because the board didn't want another alpha male as captain. Then debarring him from selection for the 1995 test series vs Australia(haynes sued them and won) which resulted in our first test series loss in 15 years

Maybe WI need to change their Crest from Palm Trees to Steel Pan that might motivate the masses!!!

In reply to WIfan26

Clearly the instrument is appreciated internationally

In reply to Jumpstart

Sweet! Music investment always bear fruit down the road. Need that for cricket too.

In reply to Curtis

I hope y'all know that Mulla bin Emir has about a dozen CPL tickets and will probably scalp about half of them for a nice little profit.

In reply to SnoopDog

boycotting that tournament until they fix the test team the inability to chase 256 was the last straw

In reply to Jumpstart

Come off it Bro.

You'll be the first to scalp a CPL ticket from the Mulla.

In reply to SnoopDog

nah. i haven't gone to a cpl game since the pandemic. and after staying up until 3 to watch shamar clean up australia, to watching the same team that made the highest total against aus in their 11 d/n tests, to not being able to chase 256 against an attack that paled in comparison to the aussies.....totally demotivated me to go to one of the games. besides, i hadda pay for school

In reply to Jumpstart

You ain't fooling me Bro.

I won't be the least bit surprised if you end up at Providence to watch Hetty bat one over live and direct.

In reply to SnoopDog

nah. i saving to go to brazil and argentina next year for a much needed vacation to celebrate finishing my program. its a costly trip so i can't afford too many indulgences like this

In reply to Jumpstart

Big Man like you still in school?

In reply to Emir

Ever thought that though WI cricket sucks, we still producing world class stars, such as Pooran. Something is working albeit not at the level of production one would like. People flock to GT for these matches. Is this akin to drowning man clutching at straws, in that people travel from far to support? Or is it that folks prefer exhibition cricket?

In reply to Curtis

you know how much people cannot complete a civil engineering program(64% of the region failed csec maths, lets start there).....its not like a business degree that is highly saturated(that is my first degree but it was and seemingly is totally useless)

In reply to Emir

In reply to StumpCam

In reply to StumpCam

C'mon bro you know they're both Indo- Guyanese you know they don't count in the eyes of Brother Emir!!!

In reply to Jumpstart

Keep on educating yourself bro, he's just harassing for harassing sake. We can certainly use more engineers.

In reply to StumpCam

In reply to Jumpstart

Stay on topic man….we talking about cricket!
Debt and forgiveness is a conversation for another time!

In reply to Jumpstart

The CWI should be ashamed. Imagine a travelling circus called CPL comes along for a month, people flock to the stadiums, and in the case of Guyana, people make it their religion led by their obese President who, at the stadium, acts and dances like a rum shop denizen.

When CWI arrange a match, in any format, and in any territory, stray dogs outnumber fans.

What can CWI learn from CPL? Other than they gave it away for a few shillings? I believe CPL has a 50 year contract?
What do fans finds so appealing and so attractive, they pay more to see a club team than their own national teams?
How is it CPL is able to attract young fans who can hardly tell the difference between mid on and mid off?

If CPL has indeed broken the code on WI cricket, then it necessarily means the era of first class and test cricket is over and those of us who still cling on to real cricket are just fooling ourselves. Is the future now junk CPL cricket owned by foreigners? Is this the remnant of our century of glorious world domination?

Does it also mean the West Indian idea is all but a thing of the pass, because people don't see WI cricket team as their own flesh and blood, or as an entity, thus they are unable to have any affinity to the West Indies cricket brand?

In reply to Emir

CPL aint break no code. it simply took advantage of regional rivalries. You remember in 2012 Caribbean T20 when Barbados faced TT at Kensington Oval on Earl Barrow day? The game was sold out. The addition of foreigners to the weaker teams like windward islands and leewards has made the cpl more competitive though

In reply to Emir

In reply to Emir

In reply to WIfan26

In reply to Emir What say you about club football in Europe? Why hate the club setup if it's successful and cuss out people for making their free choice. You old geezers are something else.

In reply to natty_forever

In reply to Jumpstart

Yep, but how is it we cannot get 1000 fans to watch cricket at any venue but CPL gets 100000 plus when they arrange it?

Why is it, the President of Guyana can jump and wine at CPL games, call out his people to attend the matches, give interviews during CPL matches, but show no such excitement and enthusiasm for our own- his own- just concluded WC matches, where his stadium had lots of empty seats?

What drives him and perhaps other regional "leaders" to CPL but not WI cricket?

In reply to Emir

So this is how it should be done???

Not Interested

I think WI really should change their crest that would definitely help us!!!!

In reply to Emir

Because Guyana have oil now…..irrespective of whether that money is doing anything tangible for people. Fact is the country has a level of optimism that it didn’t have before. You never saw Donald Ramoutar or Granger dancing up and down. Because for all of Ramoutar’s presidency and almost all of Granger’s presidency, Guyana was destitute. The enthusiasm for the CPL is a direct result of the oil boom. Bet yuh if oil drop to 10 dollars a barrel like it did in the 80s, all party stop.

On the point of the regional rivalries. So in 2015 Guyana played TT in the finals of the super 50 final. The match was sold out for two reasons: regional rivalry, Guyana playing TT and the controversy around the West Indies sending a Pollard and Bravo less WI squad to the World Cup, Gayle and Russell accusing the WICB of victimizing bravo and pollard, Jason holder being typically quiet on not having his best squad available to him. Combination of rivalry and the reaction to Cameron’s stewardship or abuse of WI cricket

My opinion on WI struggles of filling rhe stadiums has a lot to do with marketing. Wanted to comment esrlet but didn't and now upon writing this I see CWI has appointed a new marketing manager.
However, I still feel there isn't enough done to market the game across to its target audience. I don't thinknitbhas anything to do with gate prices etc. Take a look at Sri Lank playing England now they have a shirt sponsor ans sponsors on the sleeves and on the back. We don't seem to have a permanent test team shirt sponsor. Why I don't know. Apex was part of the England toolur they are not there any more. I see Dafabet on the back of all three of our team shirts but never read any deal being signed with them. Some would come and say that the iseeu is because no one wants to be part of a losing brand. I call bs on that because their are other teams ranked below us that have full shirt sponsors. Ireland Netherlands. I think that they might be trying to get one brand to pay a huge fee while they csn split that fee across several brand get them on the shirt use that fee to push marketing of the team more. WI Cricket is a brand. The name sells itself in the sports world whoever is marketing manager that does not understand that to me should not be marketing WI cricket. You are already given a brand it should not be hard to sell. The kit deal with Macron seems to be going well as fans are able to buy merchandise ans I see some were sold out and back in stock again. People want to go to the games and show uo in their team apparel. So I do hope that this continues look at the recently held t20 in Trinidad. Apart from the WC thats the first time I've seen so many fans wearing gear and it's a good thing. These little things are soft marketing skillets thay bring people to the grounds. They have to work at when a series is about 2 months out start to push it in and around the territories. Not just on social media but have banners in high traffic areas, get on the radio learn to meet the people where they are at. That is what is highly lacking. I hope the new person at the helm on marketing at CWI is able to do that. Won't hold my breath, Dominic Warne did some good stuff but was not consistent I hope Ms. Pierre is able to take what's around and push that is what will get people through the gate.
You have seen in other sports leagues and discipline where you may have a team not gmdping to good but their support is still there. And that has a lot to do with marketing. So CWI learn to market your brand.

In reply to Emir

In reply to positiveg

west indies struggles have mostly t do with team performance. if ppl feel the WI have a good chance of competing, they'll show up. nobody came to the sa series because the wi were uncompetitive in england and virtually destroyed all the goodwill the brisbane win had created. When the WI beat england in a test series for the first time in 11 years, in 2009, the stadiums were full after the JA test. I went to the last test on the 1st and 5th day and the test was sold out for the first day, and almost full for the last day.

In reply to Emir

Look, money is a problem no doubt, but it is used as a cover up for poor administration, every body wants a magical formula, no one wants to do the ground work starting at the school level,
it is a simple process, have a good school system and provide continuous (steady)high high level competition in all age group forget test and ODIS for about 3 years you will see the benefits

I want to draw an example of three areas where I have operational Insights (as part of Research case studies):
1. English Premier League
2. MCC (Lord's Cricket)
3. MLS - Football in the USA

Each of these have a Financial Organizational structure where the Office/Department of Sales pays the Marketing Board for a "Sell out Crowd" for each match day.

If there are empty seats, Marketing is fined by by Sales based on the Price value of the empty seat - so it is imperative that the Marketing team does their due diligence especially during the week leading up to match day. They first Call Season ticket holders to validate they will attend, and if not, they take those tickets away and resell or give it to charity (Schools, academy, raffle, etc.) to ensure someone will attend.

On a daily basis they keep reviewing the Sales Chart for empty seats and go out to get that ticket sold.

They run Sports as a business and they get matches sold out.

In essence it boils down to Marketing - how do we get a good Marketing team to meet the seating and by extension, the Financial Operational goal?

In reply to Acid

nobody will come to see a team that loses chief. anthony joshua would not be able to putin 96000 bums in seats if he lost fights. you have to make sure you have a team that competes consistently, home and away. we haven't had a team like that since 2008/2009 when gayle captained the first wi team that did not lose to and in NZ in 13 years and also captained the first wi team to beat england in 11 years.

In reply to Jumpstart

West Indies never had any good marketing...win or lose!
When we were successful, the powers that be did not care to market the product.
Without good marketing, you are losing, even if you win.

Right now, it's lose-lose.
CPL has done a good job marketing. Guyana has done a good job marketing the CPL to overseas Guyanese...it has become a big deal to return to Guyana to see the matches and have a good time. I see people who would never watch cricket, suddenly want to go every year.

In reply to Jumpstart

If losing is the reason, why do the hockey teams in Toronto, the Blue Jay, and Calgary Stampeders have full stadiums?
The Maple Leafs haven't won a Stanley Cup in 60 years yet Imusic wear the Toronto teams uniform with pride.

In reply to ray

In reply to openning

In reply to ray

richards and co sold themselves. where do you think the first cricket packages in the mid 80s and early 90s were to? Australia and the West Indies. The start of english people invading the islands started in the late 80s homes.

In reply to openning

North Americans are very, VERY serious about their sports teams and they don't abandon them when they are losing. I went to the states in 2009, and my great uncle took my dad, myself and my brother to watch the Baltimore orioles play. i never watched baseball and baltimore was getting dread lix that year. the orioles were getting slaughtered in that game as well. and nobody got up and walked out. the stadium was 90% oriole fans. the west indies doesn't have that luxury.

Firstly west indies cricket is an amalgam of different independent states trying to make a team. immediately you'll have an issue with national identities, bias both perceived and real etc. And as we know, there was always insularity in wi cricket. nobody however cared about it in the late 70s and 80s. in fact, after 1979, you would have to wait until 1992 to have a major explosion of micro nationalism within the west indies cricket framework(the andy cummins affair). the only reason for that was because the west indies had the best team in the world, they were winning. People support sides that win

And on the subject of winning teams, if a club like man utd, liverpool, real madrid or barcelona had been in a slump for nearly 30 years, their would be riots in those cities. Especially if it was gleaned that the boards of those clubs shared the lions share of blame for the team's decline. I mention these teams because they were comparable to the west indies at their peak. Those teams would not allow boards or management to have them in a slump for 30 years. Barcelona started to fail once in the last 20 years and they chase bartomeu and koeman out of the club and the city. they surrounded antoine greizmann's vehicle when it emerged he had a premadonna-like presence in the dressing room.

In reply to Jumpstart

Selling themselves is not a Marketing plan...individual successes does not last forever...West Indies (the brand) does.

In reply to Jumpstart

Fans did not abandon the West Indies as a product, the administrators were clueless and had no respect for fans. They caused dissension more than anything else by getting into fights with players...which led to insularity

In reply to ray

i did not say fans abandoned west indies cricket. i did say the team stopped being competitive and people do not support uncompetitive or losing teams. the west indies were still turning in big crowds in 1999, when four years had passed since we had been a #1 ranked team. The fans expressed their displeasure with the state of the team by not going to games. that is a direct result of the maladministration of the board, who seem to think that a cricketer is really a glorified hotel hand and that it is not a highly skilled profession that deserves respect