Message Board Archives
Shiv blanked hours before flight to Bim camp
Narper
2015-05-25 09:21:27
The Regions premier Test batsman was reportedly booked to travel on a LIAT flight out of the Ogle International Airport at 14:50h on Sunday, destined for Barbados to join the rest of the squad in a preparatory camp on the island ahead of the first Test, starting June 3 in Dominica.
However, a source told Guyana Times Sport that WICB President Whycliffe Dave Cameron phoned the left-hander a few hours before the flight, informing him that some of the WICB Directors who had previously backed the move to include him in the squad have now rescinded their decision
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Courtesy
2015-05-25 09:22:28
Narper
2015-05-25 09:23:12
In reply to Courtesy
Comedy central
Courtesy
2015-05-25 09:26:18
In reply to Narper
In times like these I wish coach Gibson was still around.
sudden
2015-05-25 09:27:56
In reply to Courtesy
In times like these I wish coach Gibson was still around.
God don't like ugly
Courtesy
2015-05-25 09:30:45
In reply to sudden
But I wouldn't consider Shiv Chanderpaul as ugly.
..........
Meanwhile, in other parts of the world, coach Gibson's bowlers have taken 5 wickets.
Chrissy
2015-05-25 09:32:57
In reply to Narper
Commie's boys pulled out??
Curtis
2015-05-25 09:36:27
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 09:42:35
sudden
2015-05-25 09:45:21
In reply to Larr Pullo
Under certain circumstances the directors should be able to overrule selectors
Chrissy
2015-05-25 09:46:55
In reply to Larr Pullo
Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
Moral of the story - never believe you are indispensable, no matter how much dutty wuk you do for di WICB and it's 'ellish sponsor.
One more thing
You've got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold dem.
If you're only scoring runs against Bangladesh, you should retire and not put yourself in dis position.
Typical - all about him.
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 09:47:35
In reply to Larr Pullo
Could you imagine the precedent it would set if board members were able to overrule selectors?
There is nothing wrong with them having the option for extreme cases.
Chrissy
2015-05-25 09:48:00
In reply to sudden
Allyuh may as well let di 'ellish sponsor pick di team - ten years of dis crap is enough.
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 09:49:03
In reply to sudden
I can't think of any circumstance. Can you?
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 09:49:52
In reply to Cowcorner
Which extreme case would warrant board members overruling selectors?
Courtesy
2015-05-25 09:51:44
In reply to Larr Pullo
If a West Indian player was on a UK list of banned members of ISIS and was chosen by the selectors to travel to England to play for the West Indies.
sudden
2015-05-25 09:52:34
In reply to Larr Pullo
Where there is an error in process, where selectors were unaware of certain player status and where the legacy of WI cricket can be brought into disrepute e.g. the Shiv situation
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 09:56:21
In reply to sudden
Disrepute? Really? Shiv had ample opportunities to get to 12k runs. He should have thought about that when he was exposing the tail rather than batting for his average.
sudden
2015-05-25 10:03:44
In reply to Larr Pullo
I have never really liked how we have ushered out our players, so as President I am always trying to figure out how to honour them, he [Cameron] told the Jamaica Gleaner.
The word according to Devious Dave
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 10:06:17
In reply to sudden
Devious Dave could have devised a way to honor Shiv without gifting him a place in the team.
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 10:09:17
In reply to Larr Pullo
Disrepute? Really? Shiv had ample opportunities to get to 12k runs. He should have thought about that when he was exposing the tail rather than batting for his average.
This has nothing to do about Shiv getting to 12K.
All I am saying is that if management believes that the end is near for a great. Tell the man and the world that his last test will be on X date. Hence we all can celebrate it. You don't drop him after his last test when the world didn't know it was his last.
Now if a great is told that future test are his last and the great refuse to play that is a different story and one management can't be blamed for.
But what has happen here doesn't feel right to MANY people. Even people in the WICB.
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 10:11:58
In reply to Cowcorner
All I saying is that if management believes that the end is near for a great. Tell the man and the world that his last test will be on X date. Hence we all can celebrate it. You don't drop him after his last test when the world didn't know it was his last.
They gave Shiv every opportunity to turn it around. If they had told Shiv that the series against England was his Lat, Shiv would have been screaming up and down that he not ready to retire. I think it happened the best way it could. He died (in a manner of speaking) with his boots on, fighting to the end.
cherri
2015-05-25 10:14:35
In reply to Chrissy
Notice how J'ca Dave shifting.....he said..........some of the WICB Directors who had previously backed the move to include him in the squad have now rescinded their decision......he should have to him exactly what happened, that the people had no time with him (Cameron) and he had an individual who was not happy.......he could easily have been looking at the India scenario all over again...........
Commie
2015-05-25 10:17:24
In reply to Larr Pullo
The selectors decided to put their feet down.
The board doesn't agree with them but doesn't want to go down the road of open conflict.
And yes...they have done it before. Twice for Lara, and once against Lara
Moving on.
Datchworth
2015-05-25 10:17:39
In reply to Larr Pullo
A farewell left too late ....
.... Children ought to be indulged, not great men, and Tendulkar is an immortal. We are such a needy nation that as a cricketing public we have created a force field that has skewed the game's priorities and conflated Tendulkar's well-being with the good of cricket .....
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Commie
2015-05-25 10:18:33
In reply to cherri
All that happened was that a couple ppl decided to deny the PR opportunity. Dave showed his hand too early and got hijacked
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 10:19:23
In reply to Larr Pullo
They gave Shiv every opportunity to turn it around. If they had told Shiv that the series against England was his Lat, Shiv would have been screaming up and down that he not ready to retire. I think it happened the best way it could. He died (in a manner of speaking) with his boots on, fighting to the end.
I am fine with a situation where you are told up front. And there is some expectation of some players to not want to leave. (That kind of character is what made them great in the first place). However telling them upfront lets the make a decision. Like it or not I only have 2 more test, I can decide to play or not. If the player plays we celebrate the career. If the player decides not to play then that is the players call and no one should really blame management.
Being told after the fact is the part I don't like. (Oh by the way the last test you played last week was your last.) To me that is not on for a great.
cherri
2015-05-25 10:19:30
In reply to Commie
Cuddear.........
Chrissy
2015-05-25 10:24:40
In reply to Datchworth
A useful analogy except he isn't even in dat league. Still I get the point but remember in this region it's worse than that - it's about being di bag man for di exploiters as well as pacifying dat ever present 'ethic' problem.
Two years ago I saw di decline and rest assured so did everyone else who was supposed to be watching.
They are all responsible for this mess - including Selfishpaul.
Mek him go pad di average somewhere else.
Courtesy
2015-05-25 10:26:11
In reply to Chrissy
Mek him go pad di average somewhere else.
Chrissy, be gracious to a West Indian hero.
Commie
2015-05-25 10:26:50
In reply to Courtesy
Gracious? Chrissy?
In her mind she has done more for WI cricket than Shiv.
Chrissy
2015-05-25 10:27:27
In reply to Cowcorner
Why does anyone have to tell anyone that he/she is deteriorating - whatever happened to self evaluation?
Sadly Selfishpaul lives in a bubble that would make dem brainwashed Fox news watchers look objective.
Courtesy
2015-05-25 10:28:52
In reply to Commie
There are no better cosmetics than a severe temperance and purity, modesty and humility, a gracious temper and calmness of spirit; and there is no true beauty without the signatures of these graces in the very countenance.
Arthur Helps
No need to be uncomplimentary to Shiv. Uncalled for...
Commie
2015-05-25 10:30:02
In reply to Courtesy
Too late was the cry...
sudden
2015-05-25 10:30:40
In reply to Chrissy
Might be a complex. The player may believe he is superior to those around him and therefore he determines his exit. But I am no Guyanese so you are better placed than me to know the real Shiv
FanAttick
2015-05-25 10:36:33
In reply to Narper
I hope Oz wipe them ass wid this WI team...
Good luck to Tayrol, Blackwood and Hele...
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 10:36:36
In reply to Chrissy
Why does anyone have to tell anyone that he/she is deteriorating - whatever happened to self evaluation?
It is a challenge many great sports persons have. Actually many who aren't great have it as well. That never say die and I can do it personality is what makes them so great but can also work against you.
defeyeant
2015-05-25 10:41:58
On one hand WICB complains that players rather play ipl and are mercenaries and dont want to put windies cricket first but on the other hand they callously discard a veteran who led them into battle for many a year just so. Not saying he got a place set aside and has to play if he's not in form but you would figure his service over the years entitles him to be treated with a little more respect and you dont just wait and drop him seemingly last minute so. Its a PR thing even if you say to him times up and ya gotta go you should have had that in place long ago and let the public know so that he could get a sendoff or something and it just doesnt look like ya dumping the man now like he aint worth nothing.
How does that play out with a yout who thinking bout making cricket his future? Ya feel he gine or should give a damn bout Windies cricket now if he can make money elsewhere
Chrissy
2015-05-25 10:43:18
In reply to Courtesy
Bro I didn't join di Diplomatic Corp by choice.
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 10:44:16
In reply to defeyeant
On one hand WICB complains that players rather play ipl and are mercenaries and dont want to put windies cricket first but on the other hand they callously discard a veteran who led them into battle for many a year just so. Not saying he got a place set aside and has to play if he's not in form but you would figure his service over the years entitles him to be treated with a little more respect and you dont just wait and drop him seemingly last minute so. Its a PR thing even if you say to him times up and ya gotta go you should have had that in place long ago and let the public know so that he could get a sendoff or something and it just doesnt look like ya dumping the man now like he aint worth nothing.
How does that play out with a yout who thinking bout making cricket his future? Ya feel he gine or should give a damn bout Windies cricket now if he can make money elsewhere
As simple as that.
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 10:47:04
In reply to defeyeant
On what basis should Shiv be given two more tests? I'm still not getting it.
Courtesy
2015-05-25 10:47:15
In reply to Chrissy
Bro I didn't join di Diplomatic Corp by choice.
Thanks for the info.
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 10:49:02
In reply to Larr Pullo
On what basis should Shiv be given two more tests? I'm still not getting it.
It is not about giving a man 2 more test. It is about telling a man upfront when his last is. Hence his last could have been England if he is told up front.
Kay
2015-05-25 10:55:30
In reply to Chrissy
Why does anyone have to tell anyone that he/she is deteriorating - whatever happened to self evaluation?
Hope this is a page from a chapter in your book. You are jumping up and down on this one as if you are a youth in you 20's.
Seems like the deterioration of your mindset has already started.... more anon with utmost haste!!!
defeyeant
2015-05-25 10:55:52
In reply to Larr Pullo
not saying he entitled to two more tests I'm saying optics is an important thing especially when you dealing with people that long serving. At some point in the past year especially when his form started to go they and Shiv should have sat down and had a chat about his goals, his legacy, and the plans for Windies cricket. Shiv could have been told thanks but look you fading so we going to make a move soon consider this or that series your farewell. Roll out the red carpet, let the man get some kudos and some gifts an ting and thank him and let the fans show their appreciation. Dont just wait two days before camp and call the man an say we dun wid you
And if ya say that they and Shiv did have this discussion and he knew when he was to dun they should have let the public in on it.
Man I know we west indians just real straighforward and doan gi two wukkups bout hurtin a fella feelings but public relations and a positive perception duz say nuff sometimes ya know.
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 10:57:43
In reply to Cowcorner
What if the intended to continue with him, and after the last ttest against England they rethought that decision, given that his performance was so poor; what then?
Larr Pullo
2015-05-25 11:00:11
In reply to defeyeant
Shiv should have taken the decision out of the selectors hands and said "i'm done after the English tour". Reality is if you're not performing and you haven't announced your retirement, you'll be dropped.
Courtesy
2015-05-25 11:01:37
In reply to Kay
Hope this is a page from a chapter in your book. You are jumping up and down on this one as if you are a youth in you 20's.
Seems like the deterioration of your mindset has already started.... more anon with utmost haste!!!
Mate this is an unintelligent remark... unforced error even.
Narper
2015-05-25 11:04:08
In reply to Larr Pullo
Could you imagine the precedent it would set if board members were able to overrule selectors?
This wouldn't have been a precedent...This has happened many times before...over the years
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 11:04:18
In reply to Larr Pullo
What if the intended to continue with him, and after the last ttest against England they rethought that decision, given that his performance was so poor; what then?
Then next 1 or 2 is his last. As you "management" got the call wrong in the last series.
Mate all I am saying is that you tell the man upfront, not after he has played is last.
thomasthomas
2015-05-25 11:08:04
In reply to Kay
In reply to Chrissy
Why does anyone have to tell anyone that he/she is deteriorating - whatever happened to self evaluation?
Hope this is a page from a chapter in your book. You are jumping up and down on this one as if you are a youth in you 20's.
Seems like the deterioration of your mindset has already started.... more anon with utmost haste!!! sad
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Very unfortunate to see the manner she celebrates the "demise" of such a player. There must be some motive behind that inexorable behavior.
FuzzyWuzzy
2015-05-25 11:09:09
Is there any evidence that shiv was told but refused to accept? There are rumours to that effect.
summergon
2015-05-25 11:20:42
My advise to Shiv is, do not attend any send off cermony organize by WICB. Also file a age discrimination law suite and make sure they pay you the balance of your retainer contract.
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 11:28:38
In reply to summergon
My advise to Shiv is, do not attend any send off cermony organize by WICB. Also file a age discrimination law suite and make sure they pay you the balance of your retainer contract.
I would tell them go ahead and organise the ceremony and don't show up. Send them a letter after letting them know that I can't make ceremony.
openning
2015-05-25 11:53:25
In reply to defeyeant
West Indies coach Phil Simmons has had discussions with veteran batsman Shivnarine Chanderpaul regarding his future with the team.
The 40-year-old Chanderpaul, long a mainstay of the regional team, failed to make any meaningful contribution with the bat in the just-concluded 1-1 Test series draw with England in the Caribbean.
The veteran is closing in on Brian Laras record for the most Test runs by a West Indian, but against England scored 92 runs at a poor average of 15.33 in six innings.
Following the series, Simmons, newly appointed, had a meeting with the player regarding his future, and while details have not been revealed the outcome has been said to be positive.
With below par performances in recent series, calls have grown louder for the batsman to be shown the door.
Lara, who played in 131 Test matches between 1990 and 2006 in his illustrious career, amassed 11,953 runs at an average 52.88.
Chanderpaul now stands 11,867 runs from 164 matches at an average of 51.37 with 30 centuries and 66 half centuries. Hes 86 runs shy of taking over Laras record.
Simmons met with Chanderpaul
defeyeant
2015-05-25 12:18:44
In reply to openning
yes AFTER the English series just before he was dropped. shouldnt they have met with him before the English series and allowed him to have his swansong or at least tell him boss this is the end for you mek wha runs ya can get cause come Australia I puttin you out to pasture? What kinda discussion it is if you meet a man after his last test and then the next series ya throw he out?
Cowcorner
2015-05-25 12:50:46
In reply to defeyeant
What kinda discussion it is if you meet a man after his last test and then the next series ya throw he out?
Can't understand why people can't see that this aint feel right.
It feels like the meeting was like, Shiv you can either retire NOW or I will drop you NOW. What kind of discussion is that.
Chrissy
2015-05-25 17:02:06
In reply to Kay
Unlike allyuh I have already made succession plans - I'll be leaving graciously knowing that quite a few persons with whom I have interacted are more than capable of replacing me. Indeed some are better than me.
Deterioration of a mindset - what di hell is dat? Please tighten up your language skills. Clearly you are not among my successors.
One more thing K - KYS!!!
Courtesy
2015-05-25 17:47:31
In reply to Chrissy
Deterioration of a mindset -
I took that as poetic license to underscore
senility, but whatever it means, it was an unintelligent comment.
SO K - KYS!!!
openning
2015-05-25 17:55:34
In reply to defeyeant
y
es AFTER the English series just before he was dropped. shouldnt they have met with him before the English series and allowed him to have his swansong or at least tell him boss this is the end for you mek wha runs ya can get cause come Australia I puttin you out to pasture? What kinda discussion it is if you meet a man after his last test and then the next series
ya throw he out?
That was Simmons first series as Head Coach, he had to evaluate the players, he like Otis did not figure Shiv in his plans.
Lara's record is irrelevant to a Head Coach, wanting to start his program.
If Shiv was on a winning squad, I don't think this would have happen.
Chrissy
2015-05-25 18:16:15
In reply to Courtesy
Musse poetic license fi di illiterate! What is di meaning of mindset.
Courtesy
2015-05-25 18:19:19
In reply to Chrissy
It's a noun which has found its way into the approved lexicons.
I don't get you Chrissy.
Chrissy
2015-05-25 18:22:37
In reply to Commie
All that happened was that a couple ppl decided to deny the PR opportunity. Dave showed his hand too early and got hijacked
Pathetic - no the selectors stood up to the incompetent autocrats for a change
Chrissy
2015-05-25 18:24:09
In reply to Courtesy
I know the meaning of mindset - when did it become analogous with senility?
Courtesy
2015-05-25 18:26:05
In reply to Chrissy
...when did it become analogous with senility?
No argument from me here.
Dan_De_Lyan
2015-05-25 18:26:18
In reply to thomasthomas
In reply to Kay
In reply to Chrissy
Why does anyone have to tell anyone that he/she is deteriorating - whatever happened to self evaluation?
Hope this is a page from a chapter in your book. You are jumping up and down on this one as if you are a youth in you 20's.
Seems like the deterioration of your mindset has already started.... more anon with utmost haste!!! sad
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Very unfortunate to see the manner she celebrates the "demise" of such a player. There must be some motive behind that inexorable behavior.
I was thinking the same thing.
Chanders was floored by lee and she was matter of fact. She is a product of "that era"
Her Book "The diary of an angry Black woman"
Dan_De_Lyan
2015-05-25 18:38:20
In reply to Kay
Covah drive!!!
you touched a nerve....
Chrissy
2015-05-25 19:16:47
In reply to summergon
How does he file a law suite?
jacksprat
2015-05-25 19:34:28
In reply to Chrissy
Pathetic - no the selectors stood up to the incompetent autocrats for a change
That's not entirely accurate.
The Greenidge Selection Panel had stood up to the autocratic Ken Gordon when he wanted to foist the unworthy Darren Ganga on the West Indies team as captain, not long after he had unilaterally appointed Lara as captain over the selectors' choice of Sarwan.
Commie
2015-05-25 19:50:08
In reply to Chrissy
You are a shameless hypocrite.
It was all well and good when Carew and co hijacked Hooper and claimed he was injured and ran roughshod over Viv as chairman of selectors. It was ok when Gordon refused to accept the recommendation of Sarwan and made a midnight quorum stump up for his choice.
All because the subject of their ardour was the same as yours.
Then you claim you are all about process. You are all about personality ms. You fool no one.
Even as you claim your hostility to Chandy was because he was a scab the current WI capo was in that bracket too yet you embrace him.
Everywhere you turn your credibility is damaged by this personality worship you literally advocate on this forum.
Chanderpaul was a selfish average obsessed batsman. He was also a long term servant of the game in the Caribbean. Literally all of these guys have personality flaws. They are human after all. Normal people with an abnormal microscope on their lives. Most of us would fail that kind of constant scrutiny.
If someone put a microscope on all the shit you have peddled on here you too will look real bad.
allan
2015-05-25 20:11:10
In reply to Commie
Booooommmmm .. what a shot not a hypocrite move...
Go bacl
K under your stone you toaddy twissy
POINT
2015-05-25 20:22:42
This sordid Saga regarding Chanderpaul firmly supports what I stated regarding the
Cancellation of the Tour to India .
Many here in regard to the Tour to India , were fixated SOLELY on Cameron . I stated
at the time that Cameron , in an important
decision of Cancelling the Tour to India
was not empowered to act on his own .
Shortly after this Reckless decision , WE
learned that Regional Board Presidents had
an input in the cancellation of the Tour .
I have no doubt that Cameron on his own ,
made the decision , to have Chanderpaul on the Team without consulting those who gave him his Job . They collectively decided to
show Cameron that THEY ARE HIS BOSSES .
In essence , any Clashes that Cameron has
with his Bosses , will result in him being
an unhappy Camper .
Perhaps Cameron was under the impression that he was in their League , when he & Hinds engineered a Coup in WIPA , making
WIPA a part of the WICB . If he thought
that, he now realizes that they are his Bosses forever .
Curtis
2015-05-25 22:05:09
In reply to Commie
Maan...you have done an awesome job lately....poster of the year thus far
Chrissy
2015-05-25 22:27:34
In reply to Commie
I sure have loads of company.
Dan_De_Lyan
2015-05-25 22:43:34
Drapsey
2015-05-25 22:47:18
In reply to Curtis
Curtis
5/25/15 10:05:09 PM
In reply to Commie
Maan...you have done an awesome job lately....poster of the year thus far
I said something to that effect to him yesterday, but he doesn't seem to be able to accept a compliment.
Narper
2015-05-26 10:53:36
Since you and the selectors said it is up to me to decide. I have decided to make myself available for the Australian series. I AM NOT RETIRING. Thanks, Chanderpaul concluded. -
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