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I saw many people posting on here saying Roach not ready.

They obviously were not paying attention to the performance of him and his peers in the recently concluded 4 day competition.


He was top 3 fast bowler using any metric...there was absolutely no doubt that he should be recalled, even if he is not the bowler he used to be, his experience puts him ahead of all other options.

Hope he replicates this kinda performance in the tests, good to see him getting good returns, against any opposition while on tour

In reply to DIEHARD

Dude relax no. I like Roach before injury and hope he is back to near his best but the real test will come in the TEST.

In reply to voiceofreason

I dont disagree with you..my only point is..he deserved this recall.


Some were questioning why his selection, for me its pretty obvious, its not like we overlooked Ambrose and Walsh to selecct him, heck not even Fidel and Rampaul

In reply to voiceofreason


This is Essex...not England...I'm encouraged too...

but I'm more concerned with Windies batting

In reply to SirGarny ditto...if there is not some improvement in the batting the tests aren't going to be pleasant

In reply to goliath

Very unpleasant.... I think I'm to squeamish too watch... I actually think the batting and bowling are equally poor... I was reminiscing about the 76 tour the other day... oh how times have changed !

In reply to goliath

the cumulative fc/test average of Windies top order batsmen is somewhere in the mid 20's, nearly 1/2 that of their opponents

add to that many are batting in English conditions for the first time... conditions that expose faulty technique like nowhere else in the world..

Cause for concern indeed!

Are you guys watching cricket? Do you see Rabada, Morkel, and Vernon getting licks?

So now how do you rate Roach with the aforementioned?

What I am saying is this: The Pommies are dealing with the likes of Rabada very easily...and so Roach has a tall order to fill.

Roach by name and roach by nature. Not easily impressed.

In reply to DIEHARD
This is a second string Essex team,but you can mark this down as Roach's best bowling for this match and the rest of the tour.

In reply to granite

Y'all missing the point..he has already outperformed Cummings hasnt he?

Some people were arguing that Roach has been selected prematurely.

Regardless of what happens from here on in, I mantain that he will be the pick of our fast bowlers on this tour.

Bookmark it..even if he takes one wicket at an average of 400..then that means no other WI quick..will take a wicket.

In reply to DIEHARD

Roach will bruck dun..

In reply to DIEHARD

Pray that he lasts before the 1st test match...and pray harder he lasts the entire test match

In reply to DIEHARD

KAJ Roach 6.0 1 17 3 2.83
ML Cummins 6.0 2 8 1 1.33
JO Holder 5.0 1 18 0 3.60

He only bowled 6 overs chap and only 17 overs bowled by WI

Welcome wickets of course....but de kakaroach has been injury prone for some years now...is he ready....only time will tell

It is early days for the present tour of England, however I hope the WI play four specialist bowlers in the Test matches, which means three fast bowlers plus Bishoo. It could be an interesting series if Gabriel, Joseph and Roach could really test and pressure the English batsmen.

I hope people recognise this England team is possibly their best for years and years... we shouldnt expect too much.

In reply to mittheimp

What are u talking about?

This English team isn't as good as the teams England has had for the last decade.

In reply to mittheimp

not true. if CWI had selected 8 alternatives to the Bajans in the touring squad, this would have been an easy test win for the Windies.

I won't put too much emphasis on this match,theEssex team is made up boys from the Second 11,and they cyah even out 2 tailenders Walter and Nijjar.
Essex fuss team would have beaten this Windies team.

In reply to DIEHARD

Let's hope his form continues. He's definitely one of our better bowler..,

Oh raas, Roach out a few teenage greenhorns and this deserves a recall.

In reply to StumpCam
Yes mate,it's worth a laugh,in fact let's go for something better,MUH BELLY!!!

In reply to StumpCam... maybe he should have said "justified his recall" as he already "deserved a recall".

In reply to natty_forever

Maybe...Grammar nazis can get me for that. But to be fair...i kept naming him in all my potential squads..many posters on here kept saying Roach not ready..but if Roach not ready..we have no other fastbowler that is, he may not be the Roach of old..but he's still one of if not our best fast bowler for the longer formats

In reply to StumpCam & granite

If getting teenage greenhorns wickets was so easy...why Cummings Bishoo or Holder didnt get a five fer?

Roach is back to being our best fast bowler if you ask me..never had much time for Gabriel..but he's come on well.

Have even less time for Cummins..

In reply to dayne

I hope so too..Dowrich/ Shai at 6 and Holder at 7, has got to be the way to go, play the 3 quicks and Bishoo.

Brathwaite
K Hope
J Blackwood
S Hope
R Chase
S Dowrich
J Ho
K Roach
D Bishoo
A Jo
S Gabriel

In reply to DIEHARD

hetmyer for hope

In reply to DIEHARD

... more peeps thinking like me.

In reply to sudden

Wasnt Hety left at home where he should be?

In reply to StumpCam

Btw the stats of the teenage greenhorns' that Roach got out

Varun Chopra...30y.o ..175 FC matches..more than anyone else in the WI test squad..averaging 36..with 20 FC centuriess

Nick Brown 26y.o. 57 FC matches..averages 46.57 13 FC centuries

Dan Lawrence 20y.o 33 FC matches..averages 45.24 6 FC centuries

Adam Wheater (wk) 27 y.o 113 FC matches averages 37.16 HS 204*



Roach's other wicket..was a teenage greenhorn..7 FC matches..but he averages 69 with the bat

Only Roston Chase and Shai Hope as WI batsmen average > 37 Chase has played 49 FC matches.. Shai Hope has played 35..Powell is the "vetran" having played 85..Blackwood the next most at 65.

Y'all jus run off u mouth all the time without bothering to get facts and look up stats...I'd do dis shite for a living if i could..i gots no problem looking stuff up to expose u dotishness.

The bowling attack in this match was made up of teenage greenhorns..the batting...not so much

In reply to granite

Essex is currently topping the Div 1 in county cricket

I was wondering how coming WI roughing dem up

Essex 2nd XI dis?

In reply to DIEHARD

Hety in the squad

In reply to sudden

In that case...for which Hope?

Whats with this obsession for Hety??

Who got clean bowled or lbw every time at the crease in Test cricket so far, on our flat Caribbean pitches.. if my memory serves me correctly.

He hasn't lasted 50 deliveries either..again...if my memory serves me correctly..and he has hardly set the FC tourney ablaze..again...I ask what empirical evidence is there for this obsession for Hety..whats the rush?

Let him bide his time..he can wait..notch up a FC ton or two

Interesting how the regional FC tournament is now being touted as a virtual standard of excellence.

Not too long ago, it was regarded as "dung heap"

I wonder what changed?

In reply to imusic

Interesting indeed. I guess it is ok to shift the goal post when it suits ones fancy.

bump..

In reply to imusic... nothing. Just ratifying that our cricket is "dung heap" level, but it is all we got, so it has to be the "standard of excellence" ... no?

In reply to DIEHARD

Roach out any real batsmen other than a stonefoot debutant?
Like him crawled back into his hole.

In reply to StumpCam

hold tight..watch de ride..he still took a wicket...3 other bowlers have failed to do so..still the best on show..he didnt prevent Patterson, Ambrose or Walsh from being selected.

Context is very important...No pacer better than him at the moment available for us, even when all are healthy, save for maybe Rampaul

In reply to natty_forever

Disagree

It is not all we got

1 - We playing 5 day cricket. Which competition do we have that is scheduled for 5 days?

2 - The current criteria is that a player MUST play CURRENT regional 4 day cricket to be eligible to represent WI in test cricket. It completely disregards players who are NOT CURRENTLY playing regional 4 day cricket, but whom have significant experience playing test match cricket. Some have been quite successful at playing test match cricket. Certainly much more so than the current eligible cricketers.

3 - The alleged goal of the WICB is to maintain the prestige and primacy of regional 4 day cricket over other forms of the game and to put in place policies that reinforce those goals.

3 - In essence, the WICB would rather "cut off it's nose and spoil it's face" than select players who are proven to be better than those currently eligible and selected to the test team, to realize the goal stated above.

4 - That most of the players who have test experience but have been sidelined due to the WICB test selection policy are also the only players from the region in demand from foreign teams is telling in many ways. You're only in demand if you're good. You're deemed to be good if you're the best or among the best in your region. So by definition, the players currently selected are NOT the best in the region.

5 - The WICB hopes (no pun intended) that the current test team, through their "loyalty" to WI cricket, will learn and develop in the international arena and eventually bring success to the team.

6 - So what happens if one or two of these players do become successful and are then deemed to be good enough to be in demand elsewhere? Then WICB back to square one? (again....no pun intended)

7 - Given all of this....the current WI standard of excellence for the test team is fraudulent. It's a FAKE STANDARD.

I have no problem with the players of the current test team. They've been GIVEN an opportunity and have taken it. But even they know..if they're honest with themselves....that they're MAINLY there due to circumstance. Not because they're the best of what we got.


One more thing. Many people.....including most of the WICB and their selectors....have little but contempt for T20 cricket, and by extension, players that participate regularly in that arena.

They do so at not only their peril....but to the detriment of the game.

If they so care about test cricket and it's alleged primacy....they need to change their attitude.

In reply to imusic... so you feel from you play cricket (regardless of the league and format) you are eligible?

Well he really showing us... ent?

In reply to Kay

You guys don't understand the concept of best of a bad fricking lot?

Still first name on WI team sheet for a seam bowling position ahead of Gabriel, Joseph, Holder, Cummings, Taylor, Edwards and whichever other pretender y'all feel was hard done by.

Rampaul is the only person that may have a say in the matter

In reply to natty_forever

Play your best players...regardless of league and format

In reply to StumpCam

You think Root and Cook that easy to move?

T20 has made alyuh soft in the head...

In reply to DIEHARD

If was from 2010 to 2014. Sure.

Not now

I as a selector, will not select anyone, for test cricket, solely from T20 performance.
Gayle, Bravo and others, will have to show their game, by playing either club 3-day or regional 4-day, to be selected.
Who has seen any of these guys bowling 10-15 overs, or batting for between lunch and close, in the last 3 years?

In reply to imusic

Still.

He's back to our best, he's not the Roach he once was..

But the rest of this sorry lot sans Edwards Taylor and Rampaul...are leagues behind Roach in his prime...now they in touching distance...but still not as good as he is now

In reply to Larr Pullo

Bannuh, I'm not the one bigging up Roachie!

Looks like we have to wait until the 2nd inning or 2nd test before Roach gets another wicket!

Guys, this is test cricket.
If allyuh want to watch T20, wait a few hours for it.

In reply to openning

That's exactly the mentality that the WICB has.

Doing us a ton of good. Look how well we doing

In reply to imusic

I dont disagree..but lets face it. ..Edwards & Rampaul & Shiv have been playing FC cricket outside of the region and have been doing well, and that lot should definitely be considered.

I am concerned about match fitness of those who havent played anything othr than T-20, they should be playing FC cricket somewhere.

FYI Shiv between April and now this year averaging > 57 in FC cricket.

In reply to imusic

How many series did the Windies won, when these guys were selected?

In reply to openning

How many they winning with your lot?

Play your BEST players at all times. Not your convenient ones.

This lot are NOT our best players.

In reply to imusic

They are the best T20 players, not the best players.

In reply to openning

Their test records say they are better than this current lot, but we honestly have no recent data to assess them relative to this lot currently

In reply to DIEHARD

Then you can select any previous player, with a better record than this lot.
It would be interesting to see, Bravo, Russell, Narine and others bowls, at the stage of the game, after only bowling 4-overss for the last 2-3 years.

In reply to openning

Is kraigg brathwaite a better batsman than Chris Gayle? In any form of cricket?

Is shai hope a better batsman than Darren Bravo? In any form of cricket?

Is kyle hope a batter batsman than Lendl Simmons? In any form of cricket?

Is roston chase or jermaine blackwood better batsmen than marlon samuels? In any form of cricket?

Is jason holder a better allrounder than Dwayne Bravo or Andre Russel? In any form of cricket?

Is kemar roach a better bowler than Jerome Taylor? In any form of cricket?

Is miguel cummins a better bowler than Fidel Edwards? In any form of cricket?

Is alzhari joseph a better bowler than Ravi Rampaul? In any form of cricket?

Is Devendra Bishoo a better bowler than Sunil Narine? In any form of cricket?

Play your best players. Regardless of format.

In reply to StumpCam

Name one fastbowler that is better than Roach. Put his stats against any bowler since Walsh and Ambrose retired and you will see why he is ahead of the class.

Rampaul and Gabriel are not even close.

In reply to openning

Reaching..are any of the players of the past i should choose from..still playing any competitive sport? are they still pro athletes?

There is a full XI (almost )in the CPL with stats superior to this current lot, except Chase and Roach maybe

Gayle
Dwayne Smith
Darren Bravo
Marlon Samuels
Kieron Pollard has never pplayed a test but his FC stats compare favourably
Dwayne Bravo
Ramdin
Narine
Taylor
Rampaul


And Shiv in England and Fidel injured...

Lendl Simmons stats do not compare favourably...but he deserves a special mention

In reply to imusic

Well..i see u already did the comparison for me...

In reply to DIEHARD

Shiv would be a better choice than any of the players Imusic mention.
He is still playing, county and regional 4-day cricket.
We havent seen Imusic players, playing the longer version in some

Keep showing dem Roachie....

In reply to imusic

You must be a historian.
No current data available for me to assess them, unless you going to tell me about their club cricket stats.

Dat's me boy...

74.2
Roach to Root, out Bowled!! Wow! There's the breakthrough. Kemar Roach is pumped and rightly so. The last half hour was helping the pacers and Roach produced the right ball. Full and angling in at the sticks, Root looks to play the expansive drive and pays the price. Doesn't account for the inward movement and gets beaten on the inside edge. Crashes into the stumps.
Root b Roach 136(189) [4s-22]

In reply to TheTrail

They cant get over the fact that he's not the same Roach who buss Ponting ass..is suh we stay..we love excitement.

He dont have that pace..but chek his figures whn this match and this series is over vs his teammates.

Heck i'm sure u can even compare it to previous series

Minus Gayle the difference between Imusic's "best"players and these current players is that Imusic's T20 stars would get beat in three days.

In reply to TheTrail

.

Maybe you ought to look at Gabriel and Roach record for the last 10 matches and tell us what are the FACTS! Gabriel took at least 10 more wickets than Roach!

gabriel seems to be on the decline always injured now.

In reply to StumpCam

That was Roach fresh from injury..not fully recovered not ready for Prime Time

The entire premise of this thread..is that he is now ready for battle again.

He is better than he was before he got dropped..much better.

In reply to DIEHARD

I was being generous to Roach! Maybe I should've used the data from the last 5 matches!!!

In reply to StumpCam

Still the best seamer available to us currently...

Since u want to look at selective batches of their careers..cos u comparing Roach's worst..to Gabriels best..why not compare Gabriel and Roach..after the first 10 tests of their respective careers..I'll be right here waiting

In reply to DIEHARD

Roach started off with a bang. And is steadily "regressing"?

Gabriel started off as a dud. And is steadily "improving"?

In reply to DIEHARD

Steuups! What is most relevant, isn't the most recent data???

In reply to StumpCam

Actually..context is most relevant.

See imusic's previous post above.


Although my argument is that, Roach is on the up again

Man...what a difference when is not rubbish bowling from the other end.

Dem Englishman going need Baygon

Wasn't that my thread a few months? Whilst
playing regionals?

In reply to BeatDball

Shrug...iono.. maybe..but if it was ..I was prolly one of them supporting u